CSA Child Support Complaints Forum
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John
Can my payments be reduced if I see my children every Saturday or Sunday for the whole day . Also I travel over 150 ks (one way to there house) not including trip back home every weekend . Does this also get taken into consideration on my assessment.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
It’s based on nights of care. You get credit at 52+ nights per year (i.e. 2 nights per fortnight on average).
Ton
Great website.
Government doesn’t care about changing the system. Its not going to win votes by making changes.
The system is bias against men because studies are all about the benefits of women primary care takers (ask all the lawyers). Its about time someone does studies on the benefits of male primary care takers.
What happened to gender equality?
Child support is the glass ceiling for men…
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
We want to fix everything about the system, for the benefit of children, parents and the wider community. Reform being stopped by lawyers, weak politicians, and incompetent bureaucrats.
Agree that there needs to be an attitudinal shift about the capabilities of male parents. Humans have evolved with 2 parents raising children. Why then the assumption that you only really need one, and the other is a danger? Makes no sense and studies show otherwise.
Manny
Hello
I share 50/50 care of twin boys with my ex partner, I believe she has claimed over 90% care level for government funded child support.
Its well known the days of agreed care by the childrens school.
How is it she can claim that percentage of care without any signed agreement from me?
My concern is if we needed to take it to the courts for child support or custody, they may see her claim as a legitimate care %
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Payments are based on actual care levels. Child Support will take the mother’s word if there is no evidence to the contrary.
If you want to document care amounts, one easy way is to subtly mention care levels in any written correspondence between you and your ex. If, for example, you have an email conversation about care, just matter-of-factly outline the care arrangements. If she replies without challenging what you’ve written, that can be used as evidence that the arrangement exists.
Mark C
Howdy all,
My ex has stopped access to both my chikdren in Oct last year and then claimed 100perc care. My youngest daughter spoke out telling her mum she wanted to keep seeing me and I’m.glad to say she still does
My other daughter no longer sees me and even though my ex has no legal right to block my access she stopped me seeing one daughter which was in clear breach of consent orders and she is due in court again in Match to face a Magistrate about this.
Regardless of my consent orders and the fact she was breaching them the CSA decided to rule in her favour and award 100perc care.
My payments jumped to a level which were beyond my means plus they back dated their decision which lumped me with an arrears of nearly $4k
Unable to meet the repayments they then garnished my wages. I completed hardship form to show i could not meet the $800 a fort night repayments only to be advised that upon reading my hardship form they were going to increase my Garnish from $780 a fortnight to $1173 a fortnight.
I am told my last option is to seek a stay in colletion from the federal court, however now I am penniless i cannot afford legal help to do so. I cannot access legal aid and I am now seeking any advice on what to do before I make drastic moves.
I am going to loose my house, and with all the stress i now fear im going to loose my job, mind and everything else.
Can anyone help?
Regards Mark
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Mark – Child Support only care about actual care percentages, not what is legally required. This is standard operating procedure, though the system should obviously be fixed in this area. The disgraceful practice often motivates parents to deliberately contravene court orders and withhold access (i.e. it causes children to be separated from parents), as seems to have happened here.
Child Support have a culture and practices (such as the one above) that are insensitive to the plight of paying parents. In fact, they seem to go after Dads who are in financial difficulty. They seem oblivious to the fact that the paying parent is extremely important to the welfare of a child and that financial difficulties often coincide with other personal challenges. To be frank, there are countless examples of Child Support being total bastards to vulnerable fathers.
In terms of the payment demands, they would be looking at the fact that you have assets (i.e. a home) and therefore can afford to pay large amounts of child support. Remember, these people are bureaucrats who often don’t contemplate the practicalities of a situation. They probably don’t appreciate that it’s not straightforward to convert partial equity in a house into cash, especially when you’ve got a lot of other things going on.
It’s a joke how they say you can go to court and get a stay order on collections. When someone is facing financial and other troubles, the last thing they need is to have to initiate (more) court proceedings. The court option is Child Support’s internal excuse for being bastards, when the reality is that it’s an unrealistic option – a potentially stressful, time-consuming, expensive path to have to go down to just get some temporary financial relief.
Getting a loan from a friend or family member might be the best option if can do it. There may be other financial options available to you.
The important thing at such a time is to focus on what’s under your control. You need to stay healthy and productive at work, while controlling your personal spending tightly. Maintain a great relationship with your daughter, which may help encourage her sister to follow suit. With court, be professional about it and keep it simple.
The best way to reduce stress in difficult circumstances is to channel your energy into getting beyond this stage. Focus on your goals and the actions you need to do to achieve them. I’ve actually written about how to de-stress on another site. Works for me.
Kris
My problem is that my ex vanished in 2016 and I haven’t been paid any child support since then. Our little family is struggling financially and often I go hungry just to feed my 3 disabled children. If I ask centrelink or child support to locate my ex and find out what’s going on, they state that A) Privacy laws lol sorry! or B) Find out yourself. I’ve tried so many things and nothing gets me anywhere. What can I do to find him so he can step up and stop being such a coward?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support have access to tax records, so they would discover things about him if he ever lodges a tax return.
It’s not just a matter of finding him, since you also need employer or bank details to force child support collection. And he could do the same thing again. You may have to be prepared to just wait if he continues going to such great lengths to dodge his obligations as a parent.
May
My partner is paying child support for a child he does not currently have contact with. Besides this being a sensitive and upsetting circumstance. If my partner and I marry, will my (larger) income affect how much his payments are to be to the other parent for the child?
Also, this child may not be biologically his, any advice on where the best place to start with contesting the paternity?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Even if you get married, your income will have no impact on the amount of child support your partner pays. Child support depends just on the incomes of the parents, not any partners or spouses.
Leasa Toll
Hi Admin,
My partner is paying child support for a daughter he only sees 1 night a f/night. He makes the 6hr round trip to pick her up (as his ex refuses to meet halfway),hardly has her for school holidays, pays astronomical child support yet his ex has an investment property (which she gets $350pw, cash deposit and yes we have proof), works part-time and hasn’t done her tax in a few years. All this has been told to CSA and ATO yet nothing is being looked into. We can’t afford to go to court and she has even admitted in mediation that she will lose too much money if my partner has his daughter for 2 nights per f/night. How is this allowed? We,like many others, are struggling to keep a roof over our head yet she heads overseas 3-4 times a year, buys the latest fashion etc and apart from their daughter’s school fees, nothing else goes to the daughter. I am extremely concerned that my partner will become a suicide statistic if CSA keep going.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Leasa – he can’t afford not to go to court. He can self-represent and it doesn’t cost much at all (e.g. <$2,000). The court process starts with mediation, which is virtually free and doesn't involve lawyers. In mediation, ask for at 2 least nights per fortnight, shared travel load, and 1 straight week of care every term break / school holidays. Say, you're going to court big time and seeking even more nights if she doesn't agree. If mediation fails, you can get a certificate to say that has happened and then you can put in an initiating application to the Federal Circuit Court. These can be quite brief. It needs to include a document showing the final orders you seek. The thing about court is that the big final hearing hardly ever happens. It takes multiple years to get there and there are lots of small steps in between. Most court appearances take a few minutes and don't involve very much. Judges actually prefer it if you keep it simple and don't battle the other parent too much. You can get interim orders issued fairly quickly (e.g. for 2 nights per fortnight) after you've put in your application. Getting her into court will encourage cooperation and an agreement to be made. The option of parents agreeing to consent orders is always on the table. Going hard is the best way to get her to agree to something half reasonable. Attending court can be daunting, but you can go to open sessions beforehand. They have court session lists when judges go through dozens of cases in an hour or two. Anyone can sit in on them. After attending a couple of these, you should have a good idea about how it works. Sometimes parents need to stand up for themselves and do what needs to be done for their children.
Grace Shaw
My partner has 50/50 care of his 10 year old daughter. After finally doing a tax return, it’s come in that she only earns $146 a year. She is a registered and successful Rottweiler and French Bulldog breeder and also rents her granny flat out. He has to pay her roughly $540 a month in CS. She’s absolutely not declaring her proper income. My partner is worried that by doing a change of assessment it will stir the pot. We need guidance into how to go about getting it fair and honest if you know what I mean? We’ve got proof of her business and dogs for sale and what not. HELP!
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
An issue here is that she doesn’t have an income history. Child Support are really dumb about change of assessments and about the only move they ever make is to set a person’s low reported income to a previous income level. They can’t do that here, and so will be reluctant to adjust her income. The evidence may show that she has extra income, but won’t reveal the size of her overall income. Going for a change of assessment could easily turn out to be a frustrating waste of time.
Note that our new proposed system would fix this situation in 2 ways: (i) by ending child support when care is 50:50 and (ii) by including a benchmark income level to use where income is not properly reported.
Shan11
Hi my husband of 15 years has just decide he is gay and leaving me with 3 young kids. He wants to pay child support privately so it’s easier for me. Is there anyway he can rip me off or work the system in his favour? Thanks
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Usually, the best option is a private agreement that is legally binding (i.e. made with the assistance of a lawyer at the point of signing). You can detail how much will be paid, and who covers the different types of expenses. It should result in the least disputation and best incentives for work and sharing care.
The child support system is bad because it create incentives to fight over care and for each parent to earn less than what they could. It also doesn’t solve the problem of who should pay for a child’s dental treatment, etc.
A casual arrangement is unlikely to last. He would have to stay generous or you could run off to Child Support at any time and start forced collections.
John
Hi Andrew, I have an ex girlfriend that gets paid cash in hand for about $500 a week on top of single parent payment and it doesn’t matter who we report it to, nothing changes. We have 2 kids together and I have the kids just over 50% and we still pay weekly child support for her holidays and online shopping habit. My new girlfriend and I have been paying private health etc so many other expenses. I find this incredibly unfair. We work hard and have a better quality of life at our home.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child support isn’t necessary when care is evenly shared. That’s something that’s wrong with the system, which should be fixed – as our new formula would do. The parent with more income ends up paying for things anyway, so they don’t need to give money to the other parent on top.
The self-support amount for child support is about $25,000. So, even if your ex declared all her earnings, it wouldn’t affect payments significantly.
jake
JC Mate,you are F,i had the same 10yrs ago.
The CSA do not care,they are debt collectors.Truth/law/process is departed from,the easy road.And they send out the death card,s that being you are 0(zero) you are only cash until you are dead.
Reads dramatic…its the truth.Go live your life,let go.Men are beaten by the most powerful gender(the women)
P
Why does CSA include investment property loss / negative gearing by adding them to your taxable income.
Therefore making the parent pay higher rate of child support, when they are actually making a loss.
Can some with more experience plz explain
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
The general philosophy in child support is that, if you have the means to provide income for the benefit of your child, you should do so. Keeping an asset that produces losses doesn’t do that, at least in the short term.
Maria
Hi Admin,
Yes we were forced to move overseas as he refused to give a single cent to us. Tried my best to find employment but it is very difficult without funds and a child in tow. Never expected such a harsh reply from you but I will understand your perception.
Tried my best to negotiate with him but he insisted he does not have money. And yes, my son said that he would rather be homeless than stay with his stepmother. Thank you very much for your advise anyway.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
There’s loads of welfare and support services for single mothers in Australia who are in financial difficulty. For housing services, there’s usually a waiting list – so you may want to check that out ASAP.
You could advise your son that his father’s partner is not his “stepmother”. Children often don’t like new partners. But they need to learn to get along with everyone on some level. He doesn’t need to have a close relationship with her though. Seeing his father is about having a relationship with his father, and he should be encouraged to focus on that. You could tell his father that, the next time he sees his son (whenever in the distant future that may be), you think it important for their relationship to have mainly one-on-one time.
adam
i was recently contacted by child support about arrears that i owe, the representative asked me if i could borrow money of a family member and then pay them back. is this standard practice?
she then told you need to ask your father today to borrow the money or they would ring my employer to recoup the arrears bu garnishing my wages.
at that stage i was quite worked up and hung up on her
i entered into i payment agreement but couldnt afford child support and the arrears on top weekly
what can i do now
thankyou
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
I’d call Child Support and politely ask if you could revise the payment agreement. Say that you’re struggling to pay back arrears so quickly and don’t want to miss any more payments. They should be receptive to that.
They’re just trying to ensure the money is collected. It’s up you to deliver on the agreement you entered into or try for a new one. At this stage, it looks like they’ll contact your employer and garnish your wages if you don’t contact them soon.
Nothing to get worked up about here. It’s just a financial thing and they’re doing their job.
Maria
Hi There,
Due to financial hardships and refusal of my ex-husband (we recently divorced), me and my son had no choice but to leave Australia temporarily and go back to my home country. Luckily, I was able to file a child support claim and we got some money for 2 months. Now, my ex moved to another state and refused to declare his new employment; his new wife prohibits him from talking to my son and sending money. He has not paid his child support since November 2018.
My son and I are coming back to Australia before 2019 ends and I just want to know how can I make my ex pay while we are overseas.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
I don’t think you can force him to do anything.
Did you really have to move overseas? I don’t believe you. And I don’t see how he is being “prohibited” from being a parent to his son by his new wife. That’s either your fault, his fault or a combination of the two. No parent should let another person hurt their child so easily.
Why don’t you negotiate with him? As divorced parents, you two should be be living reasonably near each other long term so that your son can see both his parents. If you offer something that benefits him and your son, he might be willing to cooperate more with child support.
Duncan GORRIE
Issues with no linkage to breach parenting orders
Hi,
I’ve recently had my ex wife change her care percentage to 100% after withdrawing time with my son in complete breach of Federal Circuit Court parenting orders. The result – extreme financial hardship considering the cost of daily life with the added expense of contravention proceedings in court and the added stress of not seeing my son. Child Support base the assessment on actual percentage of care and don’t take into consideration the complete breach of the parenting order. People should not be rewarded with extra remuneration if they break the law but that is exactly what Child Support are doing.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
This is one of the worst changes to child support rules made almost a decade ago – to allow Child Support to ignore court orders about parenting time. Should be fixed. Good luck with court proceedings to see your son.
My 2c worth
I take offense to the language you are using Andrew… this is not a gender issue (sounds like an attack on mothers) so please change your languge to “custodial parent” and “non-custodial parent”… and start from there…
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Am tempted to say, “take your political correctness and your offense and go shove it”. But there’s an important issue to discuss here.
Family Court, Child Support, judges, mediators, child psychology specialists, lawyers, court-appointed lawyers, government officials – all of these institutions and people have 2 things in common. One is that they use politically correct terminology always. The other is that they collectively preside over a system that results in children being marginalised from fathers, and fathers dying every day.
It’s a gender issue. We’re talking about mothers and fathers.
Almost every entity involved in the flawed system uses politically correct language and yet they produce rampant gender bias. The experience of a father going through the family court and child support systems is absolutely nothing like the experience of a mother. That’s guaranteed by the biases that exist. And it is because of gender, whether you are a mother / female or a father / male.
That’s not to say that mothers don’t suffer in some circumstances by failures in the things like the administration of child support. I’ve addressed many such issues below. But it’s the absolute truth that the systems are geared against fathers and child support payers, and that this has numerous negative outcomes – including many deaths by suicide.
Use correct language that signals gender neutrality has not prevented system failure in any discernible way. At the same time, political correctness hamstrings people seeking truth and reform. How can you point out gender bias, if there are language rules that prevent you from even discussing the issue? How can you discuss real gender bias that actually happens all the time, when the mere act of doing so has people labelling you as sexist?
Gender has to be part of the conversation. For proper reform to happen, these institutions and people have to, at some point, contemplate the experiences of men caught in the system. Only then might people understand what needs to be done to remove the biases and improve functionality.
People involved in the creation and running of the system need to keep asking themselves, how does this thing I’m about to do potentially impact on a well-meaning father? Could it have an adverse impact on fathers, children or others? If it can, then maybe I should do it differently.
Bill shock pending?
Hello there Andrew
I am a single mum with a mortgage and a lot of costs involved of raising my son. My ex and I share an 8 year old son who is in my care for most of the time. I have always been diligent with making sure Centrelink and child support have my updated information ( I’m scared of being overpayed as budget is so tight that I can’t afford a shock bill ) I have however just logged onto myGov and to my horror CSA have readjusted my income to $5 below what I earn (probably to match my tax income last year) but it was low because I needed to take more unpaid time off for medical reasons. This has been going on since August last year but I didn’t realise. Am I going to get into trouble now or owe my ex money they we don’t have ? Thank you for your insight
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Nothing to worry about. It’s standard practice for Child Support to go off last year’s income. Your higher income for this year will affect next year’s payments.
Note that your income doesn’t affect payments all that much if you have your child the vast majority of the time. Receiver income matters more when care is evenly shared.
Jane
Really happy to see that someone is trying to change the CSA issues. The system is terribly flawed, staffed by incompetant people who do not know their job.
My partner has had many, MANY issues over the years (never once missed a payment), most recently he was TOLD he earned $30k more than he did. This of course went into the ‘you owe’ section of CSA so we wrote to them, registered mail, and he was told that they would not accept his figure. This means the overpayments they are forcing him to pay to his ex until tax time will not be re-imbursed. Whilst on the phone pleading his case, the carefree girl on the other end of the phone told him its legislation – yet cannot tell us what part of the legislation to which she refers – and it all got too hard for her obviously and hung up on him.
Nothing will get done about these laws as they are just too messy and outdated unless we all get together and become a noisy, persistant minority.
Best of luck getting changes through parliament.
Tax the reciever (the Govt would be out of debt in no time), base payments on net wage instead of gross wage, ensure the reciever is working to their capacity, and perhaps have the payments as store cards, not cash going straight into the outheld greedy hands of the ex.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Thanks for your support. Child Support have many “rules of thumb” that sit on the very edges of the law. These strategic interpretations always work against payers (i.e. against fathers). The laws themselves would generally be OK if not for the scheming behaviour of Child Support. The laws need to be re-written with protection of payers in mind since the bureaucrats appear to always target payers.
It’s a common theme across family law and child support. Every bias, large or small, is always conservative and in favour of mothers since they have greater initial contact with and control over children. Add up all these biases and you get a system which is simply horrendous for fathers who get caught up in it. A lack of protection and consideration for fathers has been incredibly damaging to Australian society and has, no doubt, been the cause of hundreds or thousands of deaths.
Peter
Hi all
After a split from my ex partner I was unable to look after our 4 year old son, so was the mother due to work. My son spend 5 days with his grandmother (my mother) and 2 days with me, after 8 months the mother falsely applied for a child support claiming she has 85% custody…shocking the case was accepted without my knowledge, after months of going back and forth the case was closed however I was entitled to pay $500 to the child support agancy for accepting the case ?? unbelievable anyways! This year in december I took a trip to Africa for 7 weeks when I returned there was another child support letter of case acceptance with $1500 over due pay …… I’m a labourer my 2017-18 income was 70k however I don’t get paid for sick or holiday leave so you can imagine how tough things were when I returned completely broke from Africa and saw the letter. They deducting 22 cents of every dollar i make…..the stress is unberable I spoke to 4 different customer consultant and the result was the same I’m entitled to pay I feel like this is the quickest way to drive a man to God knows what…”evil ideas that might come thru”
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
I hope your son feels loved. Young children should be spending lots of time with both parents regularly. The dodgy habit of Child Support always accepting the mother’s word straight away and not refunding fathers is not good, but seems like a relatively small issue here.
JC
Hello!
My ex since seperating has chosen to cease work (qualified child carer) and recieve full newstart benefits while living with her FIFO 1:1 partner. She is claiming she is seperated while also working cash in hand as a cleaner with her new mother in law.
Has any one had any luck with reassessments based on capacity to earn?
She has a flap trap so spews everything she is doing to the kids and even myself.
Fingers crossed.
JC
John Cook
I was on a high salary in the mining industry and was made redundant. I informed CSA of my change in circumstances and they altered my payments. However, at the new financial year, and the last four months of support for my child, they reverted to my previous income. This resulted in a huge debt that I was unaware of until more than 18months later. CSA now says they can’t do anything about the overcharge (despite never having informed me of this to my knowledge). CSA case officers have deliberately avoided telling me about the objection process, about the administrative appeals tribunal and have made it very difficult for me to get any documentation about what they did or didn’t tell me. I have a strong sense that the organisation has closed ranks on me. Meanwhile, they are garnering a quarter of my meagre salary (as I have never regained full employment) and I am struggling to support my children and pay bills.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Unfortunately, it looks like Child Support followed their standard practice. They always err on the side of overpaying the receiver and then not making good with the payer. They do this routinely. However, they are also reliable at issuing statements, which would have at least been available online. I don’t think there’s anything you can do to rectify the situation. They may just be steering you away from reviews, etc because it causes hassles for them and probably won’t change anything at this stage.
Many payers tend to avoid the unpleasant task of looking carefully at statements from Child Support. But, it’s necessary, particularly if your circumstances change, to ensure you’re not getting ripped off.
Suzanne Carmichael
Hi Andrew,
I have 2 girls, 85% of the time. My ex husband and I are on almost identical incomes.
He pays $531/month,
I am then (court ordered) pay for flights so they can visit him( I agreed to pay half the cost-approx $5000 per year). This is pretty much the entire amount of child support i receive.
Last year I spent about $400/ week! on daycare and before and after school care so I could work full time to earn the enough to live(approx $70K/yr).
He is on the same income, living with a partner, sharing costs.
The system is so unfair, and woefully underestimates the real costs of raising children.
Regardless of who earns what basic, costs should just be divided?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
The main issue seems to be the massive travel and care costs relative to your incomes. Don’t know how child support could really solve that. It’s an extravagant setup that has nothing to do with the government. Both of you are paying for it. At least the care costs should reduce over time.
Frank
Has anyone had any experience complaining to the ombudsman (or any other body) about the actions of the CSA? My ex recently disputed my income to the CSA, and I addressed the matters she raised with the CSA. She then raised further accusations which had no merit. The CSA did not share these further accusations with me so I could not respond to them, and instead made their determinations based on her accusations and found in her favour. Their determination was wrong, I don’t mean that I didn’t agree with their argument or position, I mean, technically wrong, arithmetically wrong, they included a whole section of income, twice. If they had only shared her new accusations with me (which they are supposed to) I could have explained it immediately (and proved it through tax returns) Now I have a bigger amount I can’t afford to pay, and I am told my only option is to appeal the decision via the Administrative Appeals Tribunal, which takes months, and during which I have to continue to make larger payments based on an incorrect determination of my income, that I cannot afford. Any advice will be appreciated.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support make mistakes often, partly because they treat payers as funding sources and not parents. Normally, there’s a review by another government officer before you have to appeal to the AAT. Do everything as quickly as possible since they may backdate only to the time your appeal is lodged. CSA have been complained about many, many times and yet they continue on.
PT
hi, my ex & i had been separated for a few years we have a 5yo son, when i recently sold my house i gave my ex 50k. i never took her name off the owning of the house so when i sold she decided that half the profits should be hers. 2 years had past and as a defacto time had elapsed for her to legally property claim. in the 3 yrs since she left i have never been allowed by her to have my son, i do see him but she’s always there, for child support i stopped paying because she wouldn’t give me time with my boy & my child support debt grew to 10k. Sale of house money was put in a trust because she wanted half i ended up giving her 50k to resolve it as i needed funds & that money was for outstanding child support money + as she says would be for our sons future, i trusted her word but after she received the money reneged that it was for child support & so my debt stood, she bought a new car & now has had my bank account garnished wanting more. Family Services don’t want to know about it because it was not paid through them so as far as they care i still owe her money
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You’ve made a few mistakes in the past that you may not be able to fix. Going forward, remember that child support payments are not something you can use as leverage to get the other parent to cooperate. Many payers make that mistake.
Start mediation straight away (it costs little to nothing) and insist on greater status as a parent. If you have to go to court (or even are just threatening to do so as part of mediation), it’s important that you’ve made every effort to be a parent to your son. Judges are very interested in that, and expect fathers to try. You need to start establishing a history of providing care yourself.
Angela Redman
My partner is self employed and for the last six months has been over charged for child support. Now that the assessment has come in we found out that he has been overcharged by $1200 est, he has been informed that he is not entitled to any backdate for this over charge. However, if the assessment came in that he was under paying for that period, he would have to pay the difference. I am struggling to see how this system is legal in a diplomatic society?
Could you please explain the reasonings and refer me to any legal acts that allow such treatment of child support payers?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Unfortunately, Child support often treat over-payments as uncorrectable errors (since you would be “taking money back from the child”). They use dodgy legal tactics to make this happen. For example, your partner may have been able to submit an income estimate to prevent the over-payment. So they treat it as his fault. The double-standards are breathtaking.
Reza
Im self employed, last year child support added $25k for 2 years to my income as a personal benefit from business, I tried to fight it but didn’t get anywhere, this year I had to close down the business as it wasn’t going good so contacted Child support, informed them of my situation and asked for reassessment, it was refused again due to lack of evidence !!! Bank statements clearly show how much money comes in and goes out,
I then searched for agencies that help in this matter, I came across Child Support Help Australia, Talked to Laurie, he assured me that I have a case, that they have plenty of experience and knowledge in these matters, I was receiving a call almost every second day until I paid them half of the money, Everything stopped as soon as I paid, every time I called he simply bagged CSA and how bad and unfair they are, asked for more documents and did nothing,
I finally found out by CSA that the act prevents parties to have a representative on reassessments, so the money was gone, Laurie from CSHA didn’t help and couldn’t help either, $1,000 was gone just like that, he is refusing to refund.
They just take your money and run,
They have a facebook page that is run by a marketing company, they charge Laurie a fee for every lead they get, Laurie from Child Support Help Australia on the other hand gets paid and does nothing, Beware and don’t waste your money. I paid them $1,000 and after a month got a very poor draft that was copied from my objections.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Sounds like Laurie from Child Support Help Australia is a scam artist. You could report the page to Facebook, and the business to ASIC.
Bree
Hey single mummy of 2 boys here. So i have a 5yr old and a 7 month old both to the same father…its been a troublesome 6yrs years!
Anyway he hasnt paid a cent EVER! CSA have tried contacting him but he never responds. The little money i did get off CSA from his tax, he found out about and yelled and screamed at me till i gave every cent back to him.
Hes an independant tiler and earns anywhere from $1,500 to $2,100 a week. But yet because he gets cash in hand he says i cant prove it which i guess realistically i cant…i also have majority of care of both the boys (one of which has extensive cognitive, speech, gross n fine delays so yay specialist appointments and medication is a great expense which he doesnt help with) but i have always had a open door policy so all he had to do was call and say im coming to see the boys and he could along as having a flexible timetable for when he had the boys even though he always made excuses not to have them.
Needless to say since leaving me for a married woman with kids of her own he doesnt seem to even notice that he has kids as hes always so busy with hers…never has money because “oh her kids needed and this happend so i had to”
Urgh sorry for rambling i just have so much on my head and now with going ahead with court its a bit of a gumble.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Many newly separated parents are in the habit of discussing matters with their ex when they don’t really have to. A little communication by text message is often all that’s required to co-parent effectively. You don’t have to engage with him. And the fact that he’s not paying support gives you leverage in mediation and in court processes. You’re in a position to make demands while he keeps it up.
Jessica
Hi, my daughter is almost 15 and has spent the majority of her life in her fathers care (lengthy court battles, manipulation and DV) I have been employed consistently since she was about 6mths old and he stopped working the day I left him and has not worked since (daughter was 18mths old when the relationship ended!) he is claiming disability support pension (don’t get me started on his “so called disability”) and I am tired of paying so much child support when he can go and get a job. Unfortunately due to the distance between us and the history of DV having her in my care more is not possible (as a teenager she maybe wants to spend 1 weekend a month with me). My ex is in a better position financially than I am (he is paying off a mortgage) I am renting and struggling to make ends meet just keeping a roof over my head, I am a small business owner however my income is very sporadic and unpredictable and this FY business hasn’t been going well. Last years taxable income was $55k and my CSA assessment came in at $7000 annually. Over the 14yrs of paying child support I have calculated I have paid almost $98k, my daughter does not go without and I don’t know how he manages to afford her the luxuries he buys her (iPhone X, Apple Mac computer, brand name clothing and shoes). I manage my money well and budget (barefoot investor) but I feel like I’m only working for the tax man and my ex. Feeling frustrated.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
The system is flawed by requiring payers to give receiving parents extra money for not working. We would prefer to go back to the approach where how much you pay depends on how much you earn, and not on the other parent’s income. That way, payers aren’t penalised for the other parent sitting around at home. It would encourage both parents to work harder, and reduce conflict and resentment.
Scott
Hey there my name is Scott, I’m just needing some help about what to do with child support. I have a tax return from last year that I need to do and CSA have been using an old estimate, I’m no longer doing this job so my earning capacity is much lower. What will happen if a lodge that tax return? Any help would be much appreciated
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You’ll get a new assessment when you lodge your tax return (backdated because the tax return is overdue – no gain from delaying). You can submit an income estimate for this financial year if 2017-18 taxable income overstates your likely earnings for 2018-19.
Frustrated stepmom.
Hi
I have 2 x step children where my husband has been paying his ex wife CS for almost 5 years now. She benefited greatly from the divorce where subsequently when I got together with my husband, I ended up paying a chunk off his debt (which ultimately was the money that went to her). My husband only has regular care where his ex is still reluctant to include me in as a ‘parent’ who can help look after the kids & do school pick ups etc. My husband pays her CS where it is evident she is profiting off him with the current system. She is very savvy with the system where additionally she asks for ‘half’ of everything else ie extra curricular activites, OSCH (even though when in her care), medical bills (always seems to send them to specialists instead of GP & we have them on our health cover so she saves money). She continues to use the excuse that she works her shifts around my ex- husband (he is shift worker) so he should pay more. I told my husband a couple of years ago that the ‘extra’ payments outside CS, we should only be paying the percentage of care we have them, but she wont agree to it. Every time he tries to fight she continues to manipulate him by giving him ultimatums where if he doesnt pay she will take away something else ie stop sending clothes etc. We also have had to move out of our smaller place & now renting in a bigger house so we can accommodate the children (we have them approx 110 days per year) and the fact I am now pregnant. I pay for the rent for a larger house which I feel is a waste of money at times as we dont have the children as often as we want & should. I am due soon and I know that the maintanence will drop a little bit but so will my pay once on maternity leave. Why should I then go back to work earlier just so we can survive whilst he continues to pay his ex all this extra money? We have been relying on my pay for bills etc so things will be pretty tight. My husband (unfortunately after the bad advice of a male colleague) salary sacrifices our cars & now cant get out of the contracts for at least another year. This of course didnt change the CS payments and made our financial position worse. This is how desperate higher income earners are getting who are paying more CS – we now know it wasnt the best decision.
I have said that once I am on maternity leave that I will be available to help out more with the children and we are better position to have more custody. We of course want the children to be a part of their little brother/sisters life. Shared care is what we want, 60/40 to start with. She has already put a block up & continues to use the excuse that the children are settled with her. Both my husband and I have wonderful extended families who are a great influence in the childrens lives and want to see them more. My husband just wont rock the boat and continues to pay the money (as it is easier and doesnt want the kids to be exposed to negativity). But it is all a facade and we keep putting on happy faces for the kids but causes a strain & stress on our relationship. I am frustrated and disappointed, especially as a woman, that people continue to manipulate & monopolize over a very flawed system. My husband has been propping his ex wife up for years now where I feel he is still financially married to her. He is assisting paying off her mortgage in the house they lived in and its evident she is living a more comfortable life. Although I have been able to help with his huge debt we are still behind financially & cant afford to buy a house big enough for the 5 of us.
Why should we suffer due to a system that isnt necessarily set up just for the children? We are in that similar scenario you presented where my husbands ‘gross’ income is about 20k more than hers so she is getting a more financial gain. I have read everything I can about child support & there is not much more we can do except if she doesnt agree to us having more care we will have to go down the line of mediation & family court (which is a waste of money & we end up paying through the nose for it if we initiate. PLUS it is a horrible process and the children shouldnt have to be exposed to it.)
I dont think there is anything further you can suggest? I have read everything on your site which is very informative. I suppose I just wanted to tell my story from the ‘step mothers’ perspective.
I am hoping that one day the system will change to be a fairer one for both parents and we need more people like yourself advocating this.
The children deserve all of us happy and co-parenting together amicable.
Cheers
SM
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
It really is a shame that the people who gave us the Child Support Scheme didn’t think through the flow-on consequences of payments. They took away the ability for many payers to choose to be generous with their children, instead forcing them to make often-excessive payments that take away from other things (such as financial security for future spouses and children).
I agree that you’re in a difficult situation and there’s probably not a lot you can do. But I will say that mediation could be worth doing. The parents may be able to correct any current problems and misunderstandings. Any care-time concessions from your partner’s ex would be a bonus.
Agree also that the court thing would probably be unwise. Judges don’t really care if fathers have limited time with their children. They tend to consider that it’s enough for children to know their father. They are totally wrong of course, but that’s the current system.
Notwithstanding the bias against fathers, a possible strategy to get more time is to convince the other parent that you’re prepared to go through years of court proceedings if she’s unwilling to make some concessions (and it currently takes years to get to a final hearing). It’s worth going in hard at the start of mediation even if it’s a bluff.
Frank
Hi,
Just wanted to express my concern. My partner and i have equal custody, equal time and equal expenses however, because i earn more money due to the fact my ex-wife refuses to work. I am forced to pay more money for a child who is 11 years of age . I have politely asked my ex if she is willing to enter a private arrangement and we can contribute to our sons education by setting up a interest saving trust fund. She refused purely for the reason if she doesn’t have child support she cannot get centrelink benefits. So i have asked myself is this person thinking for the best interest of the child or for herself? Is there anything i can do because the money i pay is not justified with proven receipts that it has gone to our child. Even though i pay her child support i still have to pay additional things like clothes, soccer membership, school excursions etc?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
The money your ex is receiving is an entitlement under the current scheme. Our alternative formula would eliminate it because it’s unfair and not good for children. But your ex is not doing anything unusual. Government policy is currently on her side.
Mick
I currently have three different assessments ie different dollar values, for the same two kids, but three different assessment periods, all issued 5th Sept, how do I know which one is to apply???
Also what if the other partner hasn’t put in a tax return for years?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Mick – You should have a series of assessments with non-overlapping dates. All of them apply (unless they have been superseded by a new assessment). The only figures you really have to worry about are the amount due currently and the regular amount to be paid going forward. Tax returns normally only impact on the assessment if taxable income is greater than about $25,000.
Xiaojin You
My ex hasn’t paid me child support since early 2016. He gave me $1000 cash in 2017, and $500 cash in 2018, and that’s all. I tried to add the payments as extrordinary payments on CSA in my account, but it kept reminding me being technical error after I hit submit button.
Anyway, CSA shows he is now owing me (overdue )more than $6700. However there is no money to be paid to me, because he is self-employed, and he receives payments from his clients (mainly overseas) via cash payment, or bank direct deposit to his business account. He refuses to pay child support amount, or share my daughter’s schooling expenses (public school), although he said he was better than my current partner because he was rich now( which was so stupid and selfish).
CSA last year told me that unfortunately they were unable to chase him for the money. I wonder is there really no way to reveal his financial situation? I wonder if I call ATO to get him pay tax properly, so that his tax issues can be brought into ATO’s attention and then help CSA and me to get his overdue payment.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
It sounds like he is using business funds to pay for personal expenses, which could well be associated with improper accounting practices. Reporting him to the ATO could cause problems for him and, therefore, your daughter. Alternatively, you could indicate to him that you’re thinking about reporting his activity to the ATO as it seems suspicious and you are missing out on child support. The risk of being subject to a tax audit (which no-one likes) could motivate him to start paying. A letter along these lines sent to him via a lawyer might get results.
Unlucky
I’ve been through mediations, CSA, change of assessments, tribunal, court and a 4.5 day trial in the Australian Family Law court system…this takes years and years and cost me everything financially to represent myself against my very wealthy “self-employed” ex-husband and his family. I’ve been through numerous help lines and government systems for domestic violence, abuse and the police. This is not in the children’s best interest and certainly not mine. These systems not only fail us but the employees as well. Like any job, some people actually do their job of quality and some could care less….next, next, next.
Who will you lobby to? A corrupt politician, a lying family consultant hired by the court who’s barely qualified to even evaluate children or parenting skills, an overpaid solicitor or barrister specializing in Family Law or the director of CSA, ATO, ASIC SMSF? I’ve done it already! The wealthy are still wealthy and the poor still poor no different then a criminal is still a criminal because the penalties are so weak and lame like a corrupt policeman overlooking his “duties” let alone the oath he took before he was awarded his badge of “I’ll do what I want when I want”.
I wouldn’t wish what I’ve been through on anyone! Have I stopped fighting these injustices’ for my children’s safety and well-being? No, because they deserve better! I didn’t give birth to them so they could have a crappy life, I guess that’s what my life is for at the moment…I battle on hoping for “Karma” to come full circle, the ATO and other government agencies to finally do their jobs and audit their wealthy father, his family and all of their businesses….Fingers crossed for justice despite all the concrete evidence?!? Money buys a lot, not that my children would know.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Good to hear that you’ve stopped fighting the “injustices”. When children have a wealthy parent, it’s not the other parent’s job to try to prevent access and get the money for themselves. Children share in wealth by spending time with the parent who has it. Hopefully, the children will continue to benefit from his wealth after they’ve reached 18 and child support no longer applies.
Mr Anonymous
I think CSA is a plain and simple rort system in place to screw the male.
My ex finally decided to organise child support after i kept annoying her to.. i see my kids every weekend thanks god, and she has them sunday night to thursday.
It was estimated that my Child Support will be 270 a fortnight. I agreed and payments started and just took a while to be released to my ex. She started complaining blaming me that Im not releasing the money. I said its not me..company has already removed it from my pay.
Next think i have a lettet from CSA stating that I owe my ex $1000.
Week after it was that I owe her 800? Im like what the hell. Why? Ive been paying as agreed. Nothing has changed?! Why the hell do i have to pay more? FOR WHAT?
I did a little overtime at work to save a little more and CSA took all the OT? The whole lot.
Its like what, men a meant to rot in hell now? Pay everything and live with nothing?
Keepin in mind my ex wife (18years) married for 9 kicked me out like a dog. Like trash. Only to sleep with someone else the very next day.
Her sister thrives on the fact she does nothing and receieves child suport which is paying her mortgage. And she works 2to 3 days a week which is tax free pay.
Its just a joke.
This system is a joke.
CSA making money of broken families. Makes me sick to the core.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You can see what’s been happening with required payments by checking your various statements from Child Support. You might be better off monitoring your finances instead of complaining about them. Many payers and recipients have it worse than you unfortunately.
Ashley Trewin
Hi there,
I would have to say that action needs to be taken urgently with regards to the system and the lack of power the CSA seems to have. I was able to to find out that the father of my child is employed and working from his linked in profile, for which I just googled. I dont understand how child support agency does not have the power to do a quick google search or perhaps a Facebook search to find out things like, does he/she have a nice car, house or going on holidays? I havent received a payment for 3 months now, all the while my daughters father has been working. I have given details of employer to CSA, but it seems to take weeks to just make a phone call to confirm employment. Perhaps they need more staff to better manage cases. Its not fair that anyone should get away with not paying, all the while you struggle to raise a child that is both equal parts of their parents. I have my daughter 100% of the time because her father wont have contact ( I would love him to though ) and i am raising her emotionally, mentally and physically, the least i feel he can do is help financially.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Do you really think it’s a good idea to have a team of bureaucrats running around doing private investigations to collect child support? Would often be a great waste of taxpayer money. Simplifying the calculation would be a better approach, along with increasing base-level payment obligations. You should benefit eventually from your ex’s current earnings (such as at tax return time).
Felix
Hi everyone, I strongly feel there is something wrong with the current calculation system. I am a high tax bracket earner. Currently my boys stay 2 nights in a fortnight with me. I also see them every Wednesday for dinner and I spend time with them every other weekend when their mom says it is OK. My ex and I are looking to change the care arrangements to a 50/50 split, and I will me moving closer to see them more often. This is what is best for the boys. Using the current formula though it means that my child support to her will only reduce by about 35%, not even 50%. The reduction is not sufficient to offset the additional before and after care costs that I will incur. So it will actually cost me net-net more than it costs me at the moment to have the boys with me for 50% of their time. In my opinion the current system benefits the lower income earner out of proportion and that is unfair. It also makes it very difficult to make a decision like in my case where it will cost me a lot more to have by boys with me more often. I am going to close my eyes and do it because I’ll never get that change back – I benefit. But my ex also benefits financially, without lifting a finger.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You’re right Felix that the calculations don’t make sense. The current scheme was created by a team of mostly lawyers. Costs for 2 days of care per fortnight are considered to be about the same as for 5 nights! Also, they share income between parents socialism-style rather than making each parent individually responsible for providing a certain amount of care. And they assume separated parents spend like a married couple. The scheme is a horrible mess and it impacts on many parents like you unfairly.
Sarah
Hi Andrew.
Not sure if you have any idea if there is anything I can do? My ex has refused to pay child support since we separated 18 months ago (in fact he cant even be bothered to see the kids, aged 11 and 17). he has accumulated a substantial debt, and has been hopping from employer to employer as soon as the CSA track him down, Now he has registered as a Propriety company and will have the car yards (hes a salesman) that he works for pay his company and draw wages from the company . Apparently he plans to avoid his income being anything reasonable by “employing” his new girlfriend, paying her a large salary and them living off it together…am I likely to ever see any child support?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Sarah – His tactics shouldn’t work. Child Support have the power to take his dodgy financial arrangements into account if you apply for a Change of Assessment. Also, the debt stays until it’s paid.
Sally Purcell
My daughter received a letter from CSA to inform her that her ex partner was no longer working and would not be receiving child support now . . However every time she messaged him in regards to working out what days he would like to see their son he would message back nah not that day I only have Tuesday off work this week . . My daughter rang the CSA to be told oh well he said he’s not working and there’s not much we can do if we don’t know where he’s working .So my daughter then spent 2 months trying to secretly follow him to see where he drives to every morning until she finally found his exact place of work and took photos OF HIM WORKING in the ķitchen of the restaurant ( hes a qualified chef). . She rang the ATO and the CSA with this information only to be told well theres not much we can do if the business owner does not admit this guys working there and for cash …..OMG what a joke . . This is not the CHILD support agency its tbe non paying tax avoiding ( illegal ) person support agency .. disgusting
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Has your daughter applied for a Change of Assessment – Reason 8 (Earning Capacity)? The reviewer at Child Support would have the power to restore the father’s child support income to it’s former level.
Anthony
My ex wife has recently left her partner of 10 years and he has revealed that she would receive regular payments for her own business of cash in hand. She works for herself and contracts out to 2 x other employers and apparently hasn’t billed one employer for some time as she doesn’t want her income to affect her child support assessment until it ends in a few weeks. The child support is about to end as my son is about to turn 18 and then she will put in a massive amount of billable hours and will have stolen thousands of dollars from me.
I notice that everything always mentions about the payer trying to avoid paying child support but there seems to be little regard for the receiving parent also doing the wrong thing. My ex wife has basically been unable to support herself since I left but I bet that once the child support stops her annual income will at least double. These people are criminals and should be investigated and forced to pay some money back. Unfortunately no formula will work out fairly for child support as both families circumstances need to be taken into account. Just be glad to be done with it all in the next week or so. The system is broken for many.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Actually, there’s no need to make child support depend on the circumstances of the main carer. That’s how it used to be in Australia and what we’re proposing. Too late for you but see home page for details.
Leanne Patterson
There is an urgent need for all genuine circumstances to be considered when calculating ‘level of care’ and csa payments made to the other parent at a higher right than is calculated in the assessment.
My husband has paid every csa payment to his ex wife on time since they separated. When he was between jobs and had no income we made sure all csa was paid before our own household bills so his children would not go without. It has been and will remain top priority. When my eldest stepson turned 18 and the csa assessed fortnightly payment reduced, my husband did not reduce the payments and has continued to pay the same rate. My youngest stepson is now 17 and advised of struggles travelling 40mins from his mothers home to our home to stay overnight. This struggle is due to casual work commitments finishing late at night (restaurant work), as well as his social network being close to his mothers home. My husband agreed reluctantly to his son’s decision as he loves time with his sons.
Now the ex wife is claiming minimum ‘level of care’ which has significantly increased csa payments required, well above the already higher rate paid.
1) unfair that any parent paying csa above calculated rate does not have this factored in as a ‘credit’
2) why should csa payers be penalised for a decision made by the child to not stay overnight regularly, be penalised when it is for genuine reasons to support their need to work and socialise with their peer group? Is the child’s wellbeing not an important factor based on their circumstances?
Reforms of system are welcome if they are well informed and take into consideration each individual circumstance. When lodging claims for insurance, all individual factors must be advised and considered therefore lodging a child support claim should be no different.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Thanks for your contribution Leanne. Government programs have to be kept very simple to make them understandable, easy to administer, cost-effective and so you don’t have constant disputes. Can’t see how you get away from linking child support to the percentage of nights of care provided. Anything else starts to get messy. Our alternative system has a fairer calculation method that wouldn’t bring such a high penalty from reduced care time. Child support shouldn’t be such a win-lose game.
School fees
Hi. I currently have majority custody of my 2 children. My ex has them 2 nights a fortnight. He dropped to part time so I receive a total of $39 a fortnight in child support. I’ve looked at the reasons for a change of assessment and have the information stating that our children were enrolled in private school at least a year before our separation. My son will start school next year. If I apply for a new assessment under grounds of private school will he then be forced to pay half of the school fees or will they only make him pay a percentage there they deem acceptable?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Dropping to part-time work is justification by itself for seeking a change of assessment (reason 8 – earning capacity). Not sure of the detail about how Child Support make decisions with respect to private school fees.
Sole Mum
re: Sole Mum reply
Thanks for your reply Andrew.. I have been searching the internet for examples of how other countries calculate CS… clearly child support is very complex all over the world with some notable differences…. Australia doesn’t sent non-compliant parents to gaol unlike UK, Canada & America… yet!..
I believe that there should be a minimum CS payment that custodial parent receive (based on MIHL).. It is outrageous and insulting that some custodial parents receive a few dollars per month to raise children.. These kids go without so much as a result… perpetuating the poverty cycle.
https://www.dss.gov.au/our-responsibilities/families-and-children/publications-articles/a-comparison-of-child-support-schemes-in-selected-countries?HTML
In Norway, they have a practice called “advance maintenance” where the government guarantee payments to the custodial parent when there is a history of irregular payments (which is recouped by the government). That way the children are not disadvantaged. This also contributes to the very low levels of child poverty in Norway.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
What we’re proposing would be the simplest system in the world, while being highly effective. Not sure about guaranteed payments in Australia given levels of welfare that already exist. Agree that minimum obligations should be greater.
Alex
Hi Andrew, thank you for the vast information and assistance you provide. My query is about estimated incomes and whether you receive back pay if the pp underestimates their income. My ex changed their taxable income to an estimated income with CSA which is plus $20k less than their taxable one. I can’t understand why CSA accepts an estimated income with such a great difference (tax lodge by both of us). It’s just such a large discrepancy.
What happens if they have underestimated their income? What I have read doesn’t really indicate that my daughter will receive back pay.
Thank you
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Thanks Alex. Yes – you will be compensated if the other parent has under-estimated their income.
Child support payments are usually based on a person’s last recorded taxable income. A parent can, however, provide a lower estimate of total income across the current year. If you believe the other parent’s estimate is false, you can contact Child Support and they may seek appropriate evidence from the other parent.
Income estimates are reconciled when a parent eventually submits their tax return. Child Support will normally act if actual income turns out to be higher than estimated income. That means you should eventually be compensated if the other parent’s estimate is on the low side.
Sole mum
My son’s father moved to Bermuda to avoid his child support responsibilities (non-reciprocating country). It was extreme, but his choice to move overseas. For me this meant that I didn’t receive any CS for seven years, which created severe financial stress raising a child as a sole parent.
Of course avoiding CS liability is futile as it just created a debt which was eventually recuperated through CSA. As a sole parent I strive to give my child a standard of living that he would have if his father had of stayed with us. In reality the CS I receive is less than one quarter of what it actually costs in raising him and I have made countless sacrifices with my career and lifestyle to give him a happy and loving childhood (which has no financial measure).
https://aifs.gov.au/media-releases/new-estimates-costs-raising-children-australia
According to Australian Institute of Family Studies (17 April 2018) the new “minimum income for healthy living” (MIHL) budget standard for low-paid families is (approx.) $170 per week for a child. That’s $737 per month! This may sound like a lot of money for some people but raising children is expensive, and it’s not forever.
I believe that the MIHL needs to be factored into the CSA formula to determine a more accurate amount of the actual cost of raising a child (not just using disposable income of the parents). Ultimately it’s about looking after our kids..
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Noted. There are some problems with the current approach.
The “costs of children” used in child support calculations were based on some sophisticated economic modelling. The cost estimates reflect that (i) basically, kids don’t need to cost much but (ii) parents with higher incomes tend to spend on their children.
But the scheme creators stuffed up by using spending by married couples as the benchmark for spending by separated parents (who may be doing it tough). It’s also wrong to force higher-income parents to make large payments (high-income married couples aren’t forced to spend in that way).
Creating minimum spending amounts is problematic because low-income people can’t afford it. In the design of our alternative scheme, we allow for both low-income earners and the financial reality of being a separated parent.
pat
A lady told me that when the father of her daughter put in a child support claim and the results were that she had to pay him (as she earned significantly more than him), CSA told her that all she had to do was just pay for her daughter and not worry about him. CSA doesn’t chase women is what she told her. Do you believe this to be true>
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Don’t really believe this. There must be more to it. Child Support need to follow procedures, even if their legal interpretations and rules of thumb are extremely biased. An accumulating debt is a problem that doesn’t go away simply by being ignored.
Mel
Just wondering why parents who receive child support are not held accountable for what they spend the child support on?
My partner has been financially crippled for the past 16 years partly due to his ex, paying child support and her refusing to work. It’s got to the point that I financially support him to pay her. However, I have a child of my own that I am 100% responsible for; I don’t receive child support at all. In some ways, my child misses out because he is paying her child support for their child. She then goes on overseas holidays for 3-4 weeks each year most likely, since she’s not working, by using the child support. How is this fair and why aren’t parents held accountable for how they use the child support they receive to pay for their child’s expenses, etc?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Mel – lots of parents share the same sentiment. But there are 2 very good reasons why it’s left up to parents to spend the money in whatever way they choose. One is that it would be too difficult (and ridiculously expensive) from an admin view to manage the individual spending of each parent who receives payments. The other reason is that children benefit from all kinds of spending, including on things that benefit parents as well (e.g. on a nice home or better holiday).
The other issue here is that the payments you guys are making are probably excessive. Child support payments are usually higher than what can be justified based on economics, or what is actually good for children.
Jason
Hi Just a quick one
I pay child support, $465/week for for children, also $217/week for my ex wifes care that is in my name, I also pay $300/week towards the mortgage for our house that she and the kids are in and she is expecting me to fully pay for all school fees and clothes, shoes and after school activities.
I do not mind paying some towards these things but should she be contributing towards these things also.
And does me paying for her count towards anything?
Thanks
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Jason – it seems like you are being very generous. You should read up on non-agency payments – http://guides.dss.gov.au/child-support-guide/5/3/1 – which are payments for certain eligible things (such as school fees or rent) that effectively count as child support dollars.
Child support and maternity leave
Hi,
I am hoping you can provide me with some clarification. My current husband has 50/50 care of his two young children with his ex wife. His ex wife is now expecting another child with her current partner. I have also not long had a new baby. How will child support be affected by this? Currently my husband is only paying his ex a small amount of child support as their annual income is very similar. However, if she makes the choice to have another child and go on maternity leave or possible not even return to work, with my husbands child support costs increase significantly? My husband already covers costs of the majority of his children’s expenses on top of child support. It does not seem right that essentially will will be in financial distress because his ex has chosen to have another child without considering the welfare and impact of costs of her own exsisting children.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
When a separated parent has another child, their self-support amount goes up in child support calculations. This has a moderately beneficial impact on their child support payments.
Mothers who have another child are also essentially allowed to stop working. This lowers their income for child support purposes, which can have a big impact on payments when care is evenly shared.
I totally agree that your family’s life shouldn’t be affected in this way by the choices of your husband’s ex partner. When care is 50:50, each parent should simply provide for the children when in their care, and split any major expenses 50:50. Unfortunately, due to bad design, we have a Soviet-style child support system. Earning an income is punished and not earning an income is rewarded. No need for it and the result is unfair outcomes such as the one you’re encountering.
Raph
Hi,
My partner and I agreed on the divorce petition that he will take full responsibility for the kids. He also stated that he won’t ask me any money for the kids.
Now he’s asking to Child Support to collect money from me. Can he do that?
What about the Divorce Petition we agreed on?
Thanks for your help.
Raph
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
In Australia, divorce proceedings only relate to the dissolution of a marriage (financial and parenting matters are dealt with separately). So, doubt that whatever document you’re referring to would be recognised by Child Support. They collect unless there is a carefully written, legally approved document that states an alternative arrangement regarding financial support for children.
Remember, the system has been set up by anally retentive lawyers, whose main interest is generating work for their profession.
SAMM BAXTER
Complaint regarding Child Support – I have an arrears owing quite extensive. I am told that the PP case is with the Highest Enforcement. However no money to be disbursed. The PP sends nasty messsages regarding a letter received that a child support payment has been made on his behalf which I know nothing about all I am told by Child Support is if there is money it will appear in your bank account we can talk about the PP due to privacy. What about my privacy. I do believe they can give you some sort of an idea if there is any money being paid – when PP gets a letter like that then the RP should receive something similar. The other thing a call back regarding a level 2 complaint should not take 24-48 hours. KPI should be 3 hours.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Would suggest that you’re annoying Child Support by micro-managing their efforts to get your money for you. Maybe just let them do their job. They don’t need more unnecessary admin work and you should have more useful things to do.
Lolly
New to all this but only just managed to get the father on my child’s birth certificate to claim child support. He was on Centrelink payments but now is apparently working on the mines. He has not updated his employment details as I am only recieveing $35 or something a month. I do not have the details of where he works & do not want to keep going back & forth with CSA (because he seems to not be able to hold down a job for too long) just wanted to know when/if he can get caught without me having to put in a new assessment? & would he be back dated for the time he was working but not telling CSA about his earnings?
Ta
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Judgement day will arrive for him when he submits a tax return. Not much CSA can do in the meantime without his cooperation.
Mark
Hi, Very interesting forum.. thanks
I have a question about the Coa 8b Earning capacity.. Separated now for 9 months.
I work full time, partner works part time, such that she earns about 2/3 of what I do but not because she is deskilled… she works in the same field as myself and has declined an email of a job offer only 6 months before we separated that was the same level as myself… I also have an email from her saying her solicitor advised her that since our capacity to earn is very similar, that was not a factor in any financial settlement.
We have 50:50 custody of our children who are 13 and 14. Able to walk to and from school and stay there without parent supervision till we finish work… so there is no need for her to have 2 days off a week to look after the kids.. it’s a lifestyle choice for her.
I believe she is going to apply for family tax A (or B) benefit, and to get that, she has to start the process of child support assessment. I suspect it will trigger an automatic formulae payment by me due to her current income.
My question is.. do I have any chance of having the CoA 8b I submit showing she has capacity to earn the same as myself upheld.. or, because she was part time when we separated, she can remain that way I defiantly ?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Yes, she can keep earning less. For CSA to make a finding of higher earning capacity, they must conclude that improving child support was part of the person’s motivation for his or her work decision.
Joe
Hi Andrew
I have an ex wife who stopped working full time, and since she gets a tidy sum of tax free dollars from me, + a government handout, she has no intention to return to full time work.
I’m undergoing my fourth Change of Assessment. Each time these get submitted, I seem to get screwed over. These reviews are getting so bad that, if this one goes south, I’m considering leaving the country and never seeing my children again.
Currently I’m paying child support @37% care + paying for just about everything else for my two boys, 6 & 8. (all schooling costs, all activities etc etc)
My Ex gave up full time work in 2010.
She engaged the CSA in 2013. Since then my life has been a living hell.
With this Change of assessment, I want to try and make her go back to full time work, as she once did. However the CSA decision maker advised me that CoA 8b ‘earning capacity’ cannot be used because she stopped working prior to the CSA engagement in 2013. Is this correct? Is there anything I can do for someone that doesn’t want to or need to work? (She owns our marital house outright)
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Joe – I wouldn’t get too hung up on your ex’s work situation, though it seems that she’s letting the boys down. Her working wouldn’t reduce your child support by all that much.
The CSA explanation that her previous work pre-dates your case, and therefore can’t be considered, is simplistic (what if a mother applied for child support 1 day after her ex quit his job – do you think that “rule” would apply then?). But, realistically, you can’t force them to go back in time if they don’t want to.
The main problem is that you’re paying at about the same rate as if you were only providing 2 nights of care per fortnight. The mathematically inept lawyers who designed the scheme created this situation. Just 1 extra night of care per fortnight (moving from 5 to 6 nights) would reduce your payments dramatically.
Judy
My partner and I separated 4 years ago when our daughter was 10. He is a lawyer, at that time with his own medium sized law firm. He mainly worked in family law – so he knows the ropes.
He claimed to the CSA (and the Family Court) that he earns $70k pa. CSA made a decision for CS purposes because of the complexity of the situation that he earned or had the benefit of at least $200k. He bought himself a new BMW, went overseas on multiple occasions to play golf, went away for weekends, to the opera, out to dinner most nights, ie he led the life of riley and rarely paid CS as assessed or at all. He didn’t bother to send our daughter a birthday or christmas card, let alone a gift. It was incredibly difficult to make ends meet.
He lodged an objection with CSA, it was upheld after months of him not providing the documents requested of him on multiple occasions, he objected again, same result. He took it to the AAT and again it was upheld.
He borrowed more than $800k against his business, increasing debt and decreasing the property pool. He didn’t bill clients the work in progress, or collect debts of more than $3m – all designed to reduce his liability and access to $. But he just wasn’t as clever as he thought as when the bank demanded their loan be repaid early this year he had gone too far, and had to put the company into liquidation – it seems he entered into a phoenix arrangement – but it then seems the new ‘firm’ sacked him. The assets have now just disappeared. Liquidators don’t care, as long as they can ‘wrap it all up’ in 12 months, get paid their fees, pay the secured creditors (the bank primarily) they will then divide anything else that comes in between the unsecured creditors. However they have now determined they will recover less the bank is owed.
So he got a job as a consultant lawyer. I advised CSA and they issued a 3rd party order on his employer to pay the CS as assessed and an amount for arrears. For the first time in 4 years I am getting regular CS because CSA have been able to secure payment. Although this has only been for 6 months so I am not holding my breath as he will have some other scheme up his sleeve to avoid paying.
Unbelievably he is working an average of 9 hours a week whilst I have 100% care of our daughter and I work a 38 hour week.
He has not surprisingly filed yet another objection with CSA claiming he has extraordinary expenses to meet and claiming his income is expected to be about $70k. CSA have advised there are no new grounds on which he can claim – but that he is entitled to lodge an objection as many times as he wishes – he is taking up their time and frustrating the system deliberately.
This latest claim comes only 2 months after the AAT decision was handed down.
I don’t know how many times I called the CSA asking them to pursue payment because I wasn’t receiving what was assessed (or often anything). He is using his anger at me for ending the relationship (its ok, he is not wanting for company and had numerous affairs when we were together and a string of girlfriends since) by getting directly at me/our daughter financially. He still has outstanding CS of $15,000.
I have now realised that in my situation they had little ability to collect from him (once they took money from his bank account – he then diverted all his income to his girlfriend’s account) as he was in control of his own firm. Since he has become an employee the CSA has actively chased him.
I understand for some men payment of CS is onerous – but that is not my case and he has gone out of his way not to pay what is assessed – or at all.
It’s a pretty appalling situation.
I have no doubt the CSA would agree that the system is not working as it should, I hope by lobbying it can be made fairer and more workable.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Seems like your ex has paid loads to you and you’ve had Child Support workers helping you all the way. Can’t see much to complain about with respect to child support itself other than the time wasting. You’re lucky to have a high-earning ex.
Ed
Hi,
I’m paying for my 12 and 10 Yr old girls (ex is primary carer). I have a 16 month old daughter with my current partner.
As we all know, living costs are quite high esp in Sydney nowadays… And we can’t really afford to buy a new car upfront so salary sacrifice is a potential option.
However I’m just concerned CSA won’t recognise the lowered net income and will still account me as if I receive my standard pay. This will be even harder if we want to have a second baby as I’ll be the only income source for my family in addition pay child support for my ex.
Have tried to ask her for us to arrange monthly amount rather than going thru CSA (at least just for the next couple of years) but she won’t budge and insists CSA calculation is the “right calculation”.
Does salary sacrifice create a more negative impact to my situation? Not sure what else I can do here… The system is so not accurate.
Kind regards
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Salary sacrifice amounts are added back in by Child Support. So, child support payments will stay the same. Salary sacrificing for a new car offers tax advantages but you’re often better off simply buying a cheaper, 2nd-hand car.
Paige
My husband’s ex is living with her partner whom she has 2 other kids with at her dad’s 1.8 million dollar house. Her dad has recently bought them both new cars. She works full time. We have my step son 5 night’s a fortnight. we live on our own renting and have not long had a baby together and bubs has a lot of health issues. We are paying a lot of child support because ex claims she doesn’t earn much yet she doesn’t have anything to pay for , yet we are hear struggling to make ends meet an still paying her. How is this fair? Is there something we can do?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
No, there’s nothing you can do. But you can at least be grateful that your step-son lives well when he’s away from you thanks to his grandfather.
Sam
My ex owes over $100 000 in child support (he has only made a handful of payments over 9 years). He doesn’t seem to have lodged many tax returns in this time either. CSA have his details but he just ignores their calls/letters and they are unable to garnish his wages from his current employer. What is the next step to retrieve the money owed? Can I take him to court?? CSA simply say “we are doing everything we can” but nothing ever happens. Thanks
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support (Dept of Human Services) can start court proceedings, as can you if they don’t. An application would need to be lodged with the Federal Circuit Court. Would suggest first politely asking Child Support why they haven’t started court proceedings in your case. Court proceedings can lead to a court order that compels your ex to do certain things. You need to consider what the orders might look like, including what happens if he has no money.
Megan
My ex works and claims centrelink, I only get a $49 payment a fortnite out of his centrelink payment. Why is this? Shouldn’t I be getting my assessment amount because he works? CS asked me where he works and I told them, because he hadn’t told them. Just wondering why they dont take money from his wages. His debt is now over $3000. Thanku
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support are only allowed to take a small amount from welfare payments (because it’s assumed the person normally needs the money). But it shouldn’t stop them using other methods.
Lee
My marriage suffered as a result of my business failing. We reached a mutual agreement on the assets. SHe got the house and I got the investment. Both sold. My income was assessed by Child services that year at the amount of money I received for the sale of the assets being $400K . I had no knowledge of this till I saw large chunks being taken out of my account. Recently I became aware that they have calculated my income at $400,000 a year for 5 years at a time when I not only did not work but was caring for an elderly parent and receiving a carers pension from the same department that claims I was earning $400,000 the Dept Of Human Services. They were aware of this as they had garnisheed the my pension. I recently returned to work unaware I still had a debt as my kids were both now adults, Child services served a garnishee order on my employer which resulted in an argument between him and I, him thinking I was in some kind of trouble and hiding it from him, it cost me my job. In addition to having almost $80,000 taken out of my account and pension over the years, I now have a bill of $90,000 with interest added every month while I look for another job. Even though I have documents and records to show they were wrong in their assessment, they tell me the only way I can get it removed is to see a lawyer to get a court order. Having requested a copy of the rationale for the $400k a year assessment, the officer writes that they did in fact go through my bank records and found that I had a deposit of $400k. They attempted to contact me without success and so set my income at $400K pa for the next 5 years because she believed that to be fair and that the decision would benefit in her words, “the community”. Her manager signed off on it. I don’t believe fathers are dealt with in good faith by dept of child services.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Lee – Child Support are in the habit of going after payers while doing things to help receivers. They’re biased. Don’t expect them to treat you fairly if you’re a payer. Notwithstanding this, would suggest that you communicate openly and honestly with both Child Support and employers in the future. These problems were avoidable.
Emily
Is it worthwhile applying for a change of assessment if the other parents has repartnered and has been living with their partner for over 2 years? Like many people paying child support , caring for a child 50 % of the time whilst runnning a home on a single income I find I need to earn more to pay expenses while the other parent can earn less because they have less overheads. It is a very stressful situation
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Partners are irrelevant in child support calculations. So, no basis for applying for a change of assessment, even though having a partner normally reduces the cost of living as you’ve noted.
Simon
Hey,
So my wife cheated and left me. She has taken the kids, and I’m currently in an arrangement that has me seeing them 3 nights a week and all day Saturday’s (pretty good) – however she won’t agree to 50/50 (which would just be one extra night a week). CS wise – she is now pregnant (we separated 6 months ago) and it would appear that her decision to have a baby with her new boyfriend would mean I need to pay more child support (she’ll go on maturity leave, she can apply tohave her income reduced based on new kid). Am I reading this right? Her decision to start a new family means I now need to scarifice more of my salary to ensure HER decision doesn’t adversely affect HER ability to care for my kids? So confused. Why should I suffer financial consequences based on her decisions? If she can’t afford to care for them off the current CS and having a new kid then I should get majority care right? Man it’s hard.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Having young children allows mothers not to work, so their ex partner pays more. The impact of their reduced income is less the more care the mother has of their ex’s child(ren). We would prefer child support to have nothing to do with the income of the main carer. It would be simpler and fairer.
Andrew
What’s to stop a parent talking a child into repeating year 12 for financial benefit ?
(I don’t see my daughter anymore – doe to the usual alienation)
My daughter (17) finished school last month – went to the formal, schoolies etc … but CSA website seems to suggest I would need to continue paying for another 9 months after her 18th birthday – just on the off-chance she might ‘do better’ 2nd time round.
I’ve been encouraged to appeal by the CSA ‘advice line’ about previous ‘events’ – only to be advised ‘not to proceed’ by the CSA decision makers.
I’m sorry – but I have no faith in the CSA preventing this rort from continuing
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You’re basically liable to pay child support until a child turns 18. Even she has left school and starts working, it’s not straightforward to end child support before 18.
There’s also an allowance for child support to continue in the year a child turns 18 until the end of the school year.
The time to deal with the issue of finishing child support is (i) just before she turns 18 or (ii) around the time of the start of the school year. The other parent is entitled to receive child support if your daughter stays in secondary school by repeating year 12.
This is an admin issue for Child Support where they little flexibility. Try to keep them on side so they’ll be responsive if and when your ex is unable to demonstrate that your daughter is repeating year 12. If she does repeat year 12, there’s not much anyone can do about it. But, if she has finished, you’ll want Child Support to require your ex to provide evidence that your daughter has actually enrolled. So, try to keep them on side so that they’ll do this.
It’s only a few months between school years, so I would try not to stress about it too much. Child Support probably are unable to suspend payments until a call is made on schooling next year.
Bob
Child support is the biggest double standard system I’ve ever seen.
I pay over 30% of my wages to my ex wife leaving me almost at the poverty line for income.
Yet I’m 20k down in court costs and still only see my children 6 hours a foughtnight (court system just as bad)
I’ve been given wrong information by CS twice witch has cost me thousands and at one point left me 50% down in wages.
You can hear from the staff at CS that they know the system is wrong but “that’s what the system says” so they have to enforce it.
It’s the simple fact of ether pay to much or get a backdated bill for being $1 under.
Having CS taken from gross and not net amount is just unfair in itself aswell.
CS can’t use a system to calculate wages weekly ether, I’m exspected to give a figure for the next 12 months witch is impossible when there’s almost a 50k flux in my pay.
There are pairents out there that are not receiving a cent and others that are draining there former partners dry.
The system needs a massive overhaul and private agreements needs to be forced because everyone is in a different situation.
Julie
I have what seems like an unusual situation (although I wouldn’t be surprised if it wasn’t), in May of this year my ex updated the time he has my daughter with child support. I had no problem with his as we had adjusted it but the amount he was required to pay dropped a lot more than expected. As it takes so long to get through to them I wasn’t able to speak to them about it for a few months and it turns out that they now have him down as a multicase allowance. He does not have any other children but as he is happy not to pay as much there is no point asking him to correct this anomaly. I raised an objection with CSA but they replied saying I was out of time (as it has to be done within 28 days) so I made an application to the AAT to ask them to review the issue. They are stating that they can ask them to request that they allow the out of time objection but they cannot force them to review the accuracy of the multicase allowance. It is clear to me that it is an administrative error (as I don’t believe my ex would be deliberately fraudulent) but there appears to be no legal way to get this amended . Even the deputy chairman of the AAT who I had a directional hearing with regarding my application did admit it was frustrating but that was just the ‘legislation’ and there was nothing more they can do about it. Any suggestions of where to go now (apart from my MP who I am seeing this week) would be greatly appreciated.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Julie – Are you sure your ex doesn’t have another child? That would make the most sense. Very hard to see how a parent can be given a multi case status when they have only 1 child. Child Support wouldn’t be able to do admin tasks and payment calculations without some details about the child (e.g. name and date of birth). They may have information that hasn’t been disclosed to you because of privacy considerations.
If it actually is a simple admin error, you should be able to ring Child Support and ask nicely to do a quick check and make sure that the correct info has been entered (i.e. that the multi case status isn’t because of doubling up on support arrangements relating to your child).
jo
I am totally stumped as to how child support is worked out. My ex claims he only earns $25000 but clearly because of his lifestyle I know he doesn’t (guessing everything is cash or through a company) and I earn nothing but he pays $148 a year for four children. How is that fair? How do I get his income investigated, will he know it is happening?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support don’t have detectives / investigators as such. You could initiate a Change of Assessment Application (Reason 8 – Earning Capacity). Both parties will be asked to provide financial information.
Cowgirl
Child support is a joke when it come to collect givin every detail possible and still nothing done bout it. Not my fault his desided to claim I set him up and his not paying a cent and doing everything to run CS and me around. His choice not to have anything to do with the child yet we are the once who get punished but payment from centrelink being cut off or reduce all the time. Even after all gone to court my boy 14 mths old now it’s a joke
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
He won’t be able to get away with it forever. He may also get tired of living his life that way. Anytime he gets a tax refund, a welfare payment, or has money in a bank account known to Child Support, they can collect.
Michael
There are new rules that affect how changes to care arrangements apply to child support assessments. The new rules apply when the CSA told about the change more than 28 days after it occurred. What are they ? I can’t find it anywhere on the internet. My ex-wife has been withholding my son for 15 months now and she’s just lodged a COA claim on the basis of the changed care which will cost me a fortune. Please help since I’ve just received a call from the CSA who are chasing me for more money.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Not sure what “the rules” are. Child Support have their own internal policies. Generally, they backdate where it advantages the main carer and don’t if it would advantage the payer. You’ll be able to see from the assessment notices what’s been done. Don’t think you have the power to influence it unless the latest assessment is based on a factual error for which you have relevant evidence.
GI Joe
I definitely agree, anything relating to policies involving lawyers these days are a disgrace and a mess… The policies seem to be full of loopholes and disputation causing conflict. This then causes disagreements and presto” they have made more jobs for themselves, an evil vicious system using children/ loved ones against each other… They know that parents would pay large sums of money to see their very own children.
For example.. The Family court: Biased towards women, they know that men usually have more money, so they go for that first… rewarding women 65-80% of assets during a divorce, this in return makes divorce more attractive to women and spread the word.
CSA: They come in and reward the women for taking away the children from the fathers, after all 100% custody = 100% of the child abuse reward money (parental alienation).
All these tactics are designed by malicious lawyers for lawyers to make money out of families using parents and children against each other…
Just pure Greed of the lawyer types of scum raping families these days
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
While the system is full of problems and biases, you have to have a little more faith in people. I believe that the people involved themselves believe they are doing the right thing most of the time.
Child Support have a culture and practices geared towards making sure children are never hurt, which equates to maximising child support. All they can do is collect more child support. That’s the only thing they control. However, they don’t see the damage caused by a system that always disadvantages one parent while providing welfare for the other (e.g. children end up being raised by unemployed single mothers).
Lawyers are trained to win arguments through the manipulation of words. They are not trained in policy development. The result is that they don’t do reform well. They end up tinkering at the edges, and making systems more complicated, rather than fixing things. Worse still, they get carried away with pressing home their position and fail to respond to the legitimate complaints of parents. And they have a habit of directing power towards the courts. This is why we end up with a system where the insidious “best interests of a child” is too often the basis for decisions to marginalise parents in the lives of their own children.
Kent
Hi Everyone,
Firstly I just want to say that this website is amazing and has helped me articulate better the changes that should occur in the system.
I have 3 children and share their custody equally but because my ex can’t hold down a job I’m constantly being punished with massive deductions to my salary.
We need to band together and advocate for real legislative change that holds both parents equally responsible for being able to provide a safe environment for their children rather than redistributing wealth.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Thanks for your feedback and support Kent. This website essentially tells the government what it needs to do. I used to work as a policy strategist for the Commonwealth Government, reviewing Cabinet submissions and developing my own policy ideas (such as the $1b Clean Technology Program). They could implement what’s been proposed and help many thousands of children and parents.
To get something to happen, you need the backing of a senior Minister, preferably the Prime Minister. For that to happen, you need to convince them that reform could be a winner politically. To be honest, I’m not sure how to do that at the moment. They’re immune to the usual lobbying and there are too many voices arguing for different things. Not sure that we have good enough leaders in Australia currently.
Another problem is that, whenever a review is done, lawyers and law professors take over and they are absolutely hopeless at doing reform. I blame lawyers for this mess.
JS
BV,
This has been my experience as well. Two years and no child support received. Apparently they can’t retrieve money from a bank account because there are so many banks and they can’t check them all. Nothing from tax either. I provide a new address for the other “parent” to received correspondence, and apparently they can’t accept the address as it has to be verified? CS just stonewall me at every turn.
My story begins with my ex partner encouraging me to fall pregnant, it was not an accident. I was unsure, but he would bring home baby clothes and booties that he purchased after work to try to get me to want to fall. We tried and almost immediately I was pregnant. About 8 months pregnant I found out that he had been cheating on me. I was distraught, and felt so trapped. He begged me to stay, and I did. I had no intentions of raising a child on my own. I wanted my child to have both parents like I did. So I gave him a second chance.
Two months after I give birth I go to stay with my parents for a week in another town so I could get some much needed rest and so they could see their grandchild. One morning while at my parents house, I wake to a call from my best friend, between sobs she tells me my partner hit on her. Long story short, I found out they had hooked up. I cannot explain to you what this does to your self-esteem. It destroyed me. I had given everything, and at the most vulnerable point in my entire life, my so called partner had betrayed and hurt me in a way that I had never experienced. The relationship was over, there was no coming back from that. For 6 months I never applied for child support, I didn’t want anything from him. But after that time I felt like my son was being denied the financial support that he was entitled to, so I put in a claim. There were payments made for a few months here and there. Fast forward, it’s been four years since the split, and I haven’t received child support for two years. Two years ago we had come to a somewhat good place, where he started to see his son. After two weeks he asked if there was a future for us, I said no I just wanted a friendship and a good relationship for our son. And poof…just like that he was gone. No more play dates with my son, no contact at all (I didn’t even push him for the child support that he had owing at that time because I was just happy he was having a relationship with his son).
So it has been a struggle financially but thanks to the support of my parents I have just completed my degree and will return to full-time work in the new year, things will start looking up for my son and I.
I feel that there is a major problem with the system, in my case at least. I feel like it doesn’t matter what I do or what information I provide, CS are just not interested in following it up. If my ex can avoid contributing to the care of our son for 2 years straight there is something wrong.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
JS – Child Support would follow up if they had relevant details. They intercept tax refunds routinely, but that’s only possible if the payer has paid too much income tax over the year. They also do phone calls and raid bank accounts. But they can’t do that if they lack contact and bank info. At least the debt is accruing and you may get support at some stage in the future.
GI Joe
An extract from a petition:
How is it that in this day in age we have a system that is so backwards that nobody understands it.
A mother withholds care of her child from their father, yet the father is expected to pay full child support regardless. A mother has the final say in when and if a father gets to see his children even after going through the court system. A father takes his life because he is denied access to see his kids yet society and the government does nothing. A father takes a custody matter to court to have it dealt with by the system, yet when the mother breaks the court order there are no repercussions, yet if a father breaks a DVO/AVO that has been obtained through lies and deceit he is thrown in jail.
As far as I am concerned, withholding your children from their biological mother/father is a form of domestic violence yet when it is taken to the police or brought up in the courts it is simply dismissed. We have had many publicised Domestic Violence cases of late that have forced the government to make a change yet many fathers commit suicide over child support and children being withheld from them, but it doesn’t get noticed by the media and goes away unseen.
The Child Support system is broken and beyond repair and needs a major overhaul. How is it that a father has a 50% shared care of a child yet is still expected to pay child support. Child support should be for the care of the children, not the support of the ex partner, they should be out working to support themselves. Why would a father spend hundreds and thousands of dollars on obtaining a court order onto to have it broken by mother and Child Support reward the mother for breaking the law by having the father chased for child support payments. A father who has his kids for 54 nights a year pays the same amount of child support as a father who has his kids for 125 nights a year. Child support try and predict the future a year at a time yet when this is questioned it is dismissed as the formula that is has to be followed.
We need a fair care payment system for the payer of child support that isn’t going to send families into financial hardship. Child support needs to be on a case by case basis not decided on mathematically equations based on someones gross wage. The government is effectively doubling dipping from the payers of child support. I thought the government was against “double dipping”. This system as it stands it hurting families, fathers, mothers but most importantly its hurting the children.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Yep – there’s major problems with the system. It was badly designed. Needs to be re-done, with lawyers kept as far away as possible. They are consistently terrible at policy development.
scotty
I have a17yr old daughter who has just had a baby so is getting PPS FTB and rent from Centrelink. I put in a request to have this looked at in the beginning of October because she is seen as independent now and can support herself financially and gives her mum money for board and lodgings , and only just got a call about it , they say they have 50 days from today as it was only just allocated to make a decision . they tell me today that they need to speak to my ex about it as I am stating as per the CSA act that she is no longer classed as an “ELIGABLE CARER’ but they tell me that that look at my daughter to see if she is an eligible child and under criteria 4 they may be able to take into consideration any pension and ftb payments the 17rd old gets as its a government payment so not earned income , if they do go in my favour then chances are they may back date it to the date I lodged the request BUT and this is the big BUT if it puts her into financial hardship then she wont have to pay me back any money that she wouldn’t of been entitled to if the decision was made on that date of lodgement. but if I stop paying then I will be chased up for any money that is owed to her with penalty fees on top .. please tell me how this is fair, is she is determined not entitled to from the 10/10/2018 but doesn’t have to pay anything back because she cant afford it ???? how about I tell my bank I cant afford my mortgage because of financial hardship and see were that gets me .
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
It’s not fair. Hopefully, they’ll make a decision quickly. Child Support have completely different rules for payers compared to recipients. This is not in the legislation, it’s selective interpretation.
Andy
Hi Andrew,
Are there specific rules regarding payments for extra-curricular activities conducted by children (eg sport, music).
I pay my ex the full prescribed child support rate each fortnight however she is asking for additional payments to help cover costs for weekend sport, music lessons etc.
To date the answers I am getting from various sources that I have made enquiries to have ranged from I am not obliged to pay absolutely anything, through to paying for a third of the costs for all extracurricular activities as they are in my care for a third of the time, (120 nights a year).
I understand that many people have differing arrangements due to a whole range of circumstances but was wondering if there are any specific rules ?
I ask as my ex enrols the children in sport and music programs throughout the year (multiple for the two children) without discussion with me (simply says “they wanted to do it and I’m not saying no”), and expects me to contribute.
To date I have paid for half of uniforms and some weekend sport.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
This issue is covered at point 6 here: https://childsupportaustralia.com/avoid-paying-legally/
Short answer: there are no rules. It can be good for the soul to pay for things yourself, especially when it’s obvious to the kids whose paying. And it encourages the other parent to be generous. Both parents should have a reasonable sense of what’s fair.
David
I recently received a letter from CSA advising of “No change to annual rate” following an update of my ex’s income. The previous assessment was based on a provisional income of a little over 43000 which is the same as it was last year. However they now have the final taxable amount which is over 66000. My income has not changed, it is still 82000. How is it that this updated income hasn’t resulted in at least some reduction to the amount of Child Support that I pay?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
It’s a mystery David. The annual amount should change automatically.
rachael pollock
at the moment I have a private arrangement with my ex to pay child support following a assessment, he is currently of work for possibly another 4 weeks or more but can still afford child support payments. he has told me he wont pay me anymore child support as he wants it to be collected through csa and taken from his employer.as his work is all over the place and he isn’t working right now and it takes time to sort this out with his employer it would be a very bad option for me. child support is my only current income to support my kids, can I get csa to get him to pay me without having to change the agreement?
X Lawyer
In the news today…
“Prime Minister Scott Morrison considers plan to kick extremists out of Australia”
Lets only hope…
The family courts and CSA are taken down!!
Just some of the unethical neglect from these lawyer types destroying families for their glory and greed… Basic human rights abuse, Child abuse, Discrimination, parental alienation abuse, financial abuse, intimidation abuse, unjust, lies and corruption.. all just to keep their fat a### in a job at the expense of families.
Lawyers play s##tty games of who has the most amount of money, talking to each other to blead you dry, making plans against families including the falsified DVO method.
They are the true terrorists killing off more people of Australia to suicide than wars combined now…
Discusting evil people there really needs to be a royal commission into these greedy selfless scabs of society and for them to be kicked out of Australia.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
A “comprehensive” review of family law is currently happening. See these submissions.
Barry Danskin
Hello, I am 55 yo and on benefits due to a body that has been broken down due to my years on heavy machinery in the mining industry. Suddenly, last year, $50 a fortnight was being taken from my already meagre Centrelink payments by CSA with no previous notification or explanation. After a phone call that lasted 105 minutes (including waiting time) I discovered from the very abrupt, and even Ruder person on the line that this was for my now 25 yo son due to an issue with a tax return from around 10 years prior. At the end of this unpleasant phone call my phone number, email address, and current address were taken and I was assured that I would receive a full explanation and account via Australia Post. This was 1 whole year ago now, and the public servant that I spoke to Can now add inefficient to rude and abrupt on her annual review, because I have not received a thing, but continue to lose my $50 a fortnight as well as a tax lump sum of over $3000, and do not know why. I suffer from depression and PTSD and get in a mess just thinking of a phone call to them after my last experience, yet I cannot even do something as simple as link CSA to my MyGov account because I have none of the details required to do so. These would have been in the letter that they were going to send me. All of that aside, are they not being neglectful by not providing regular account updates to me as a client? This was a very flawed system when I first became involved with it 25 years ago, it’s failures are 10 fold all of this time later. One further aside, I do not speak to my son’s mother because I cannot deal with stress, but my 25 yo son has gotten none of this money, but he is an adult, with his own income and family life now.
Thanks for listening, and I look forward to a reply
Regards
Barry
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Barry – Looks like they’ve changed your historical assessment, meaning that you owe the mother some amount of money. They should be able to send you assessment and payment notices by mail. Suggest you start by calling them (may take ages to get through) and politely ask how much you owe so that you can make payment. While on the phone, check and update your contact details with them. Don’t actually pay until you’re comfortable that the assessment is correct. Negotiate a payment plan if you’re paying interest.
Pam Challis
Hi I have 2 children that don’t see their biological father, he doesn’t pay much (which I’m not fussed over) but am wondering can I cancel the child support payments?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Don’t know Pam. You need to talk to Child Support about how to cancel.
Mat
I contacted CSA 15/11/18 to ask what proof do they currently hold on my file that I m the father of my 15 year old daughter. This all come about after watching a Current Affair show recently. CSA stated they do not have any Birth Certificate with me being the father, and they have no evidence on file that a Pre-registration conformation was ever conducted with me. The only evidence they have is a date my ex partner gave them when I was not living with her which cant be correct. I asked if this can be investigated or reviewed as there is no evidence from when the child was born in 2003. CSA just kept saying you need to do a section 107 and file with the courts. I think CSA have not gathered enough evidence before closing off saying I was the father and this is terrifying.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Have to say that it’s not really Child Support’s job to work out paternity. They may have been too quick to accept that you are the father back in 2003. However, it seems like they haven’t been given any evidence or claims to the contrary.
Beau
I am a Paying parent of 14 years . the mother of my son works full time, has been in a relationship for the last 4 years, goes on overseas trips at least every 3 months and seems to live the high life while I struggle to put food on my table. she claims to be earning 21k for the year but her lifestyle far outweighs her wage. I don’t mind paying child support but while I struggle through life she has it fairly well. what can I do to make this fairer?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Probably not much you can do Beau in this situation. See this article for general tips: https://childsupportaustralia.com/avoid-paying-legally/
Chris
My ex owes 155k in child support. He lives in the US. Child support said there is nothing they can do to enforce payments. Is this right?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
It’s obviously a big hassle for Child Support to chase up people living abroad permanently. You’ll have to do the work for them to have any real chance. The US has state-based schemes, so you may have to look at state rather than federal mechanisms. It would probably require commencement of legal action in the US.
https://www.humanservices.gov.au/individuals/enablers/payments-from-parent-outside-australia
Michael
Recently received a full transcript from CSA with regards a recent COA . CSA requested by bank provide info which was sent to them but not disclosed to me. The transcript shows my new partners full financial portfolio including salary car and expenses. This information has been sent to the other parent. When i spoke to CSA they informaed me that they can not redact any information yet they made the request and it was not me who sent it to them. How can they share this unrelated information to other people?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
So, here we have a public servant claiming they can’t redact information that is both irrelevant to the case and involves someone not attached to the case. It was their duty to redact that information. They shouldn’t have had it in the first place. The claim that they have to release it is ridiculous. They seem incompetent.
BV
I don’t know why the advice I read on here says that the paying parent can’t ignore what they owe & there will be consequences … today I was told by a CS staff member that sometimes things in life just aren’t fair & it’s easier to just walk away!
Seriously, there is massive change needed, including staff that actually commit to following up funds that are owed!
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support definitely chase up debts to the extent that they can. This includes intercepting tax refunds and raiding bank accounts.
Frustrated in Paying for the Lazy
Hi there, where does the government stand with the other parent (OP) working as minimal as possible, to gain maximum benefits? The OP has the capability to work full time, but ‘chooses’ not to. She works the minimum 15hrs per week, gains maximum assistance from the government, and a large amount in child support. There has to be a way to whistle blow this lazy behaviour.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
The Change of Assessment (Reason 8 – Earning Capacity) review process is available to deal with parents earning below their potential. However, it’s targeted towards payers and many primary carers get away with low work effort (by virtue of having young children or no recent work history).
Tornni
I moved out and separated from my husband on the 15th September this year. I have moved into a rental which is $390/week with my two children and he has stayed in the marital home which is now up for sale. I have 100% care of the children and CSA assessed for him to pay $550/fortnight. Since we moved out he has only paid $150 as he said that as he is paying the mortgage and all the bills of the marital home, he doesn’t feel he needs to pay child support. He has made one payment of $150 since we moved out. I am actually paying more in rent than he pays on the mortgage. Could somebody please give me some advice on whether I do need to pay my rent and half the mortgage as well? I am still paying the home and contents insurance of the home and paying the joint personal loan.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You can’t expect Child Support to sort out your joint finances. They essentially just pay cash to one parent based on care levels and incomes. Who pays for what is an issue for you two to work out and will be relevant in your property settlement. Payments between now and then should be factored into the result. You should try and separate your finances and keep records of bill payments.
A parent can’t just refuse to pay child support. They’ll be chased up for it and will be penalised for accruing debt.
Annie
Hi I have a 6year old beautiful boy his father has NOT paid one cent I was told buy him if I applied for child support he would have my son twice a week and you know I would just dump he with who ever wants him was he s words he owns business s 4 homes has never wanted to see his child and never has . My son is in private school can I start child support now or is it to late? I am starting this now as I will not be bullied by him or his family anymore can you help annie
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You want child support in order to “not be bullied by him and his family anymore”. Really?? I don’t believe you. Suggest you go to mediation to try and come up with a sensible arrangement that includes (i) financial support from the boy’s father and (ii) regular contact between father and son.
Jono
Hey, quick question.. if I have been lied to about a child not being mine for over two years and I proceed to get a court order for a dna paternity test and it turns out that I am the father, even if she has told someone else it is his and lied to me, would I have to pay backdated child support from the day of birth? And where would I stand on having missed the first two years of my Childs life and being lied to from the mother? Any help would be appreciated, cheers
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
As I understand it, there’s no backdating for new claims. So you’d only have to pay support from the date the other parent first contacts Child Support.
The courts have a bias of being slow to connect a child with a parent the child doesn’t know very well. If you want a meaningful role in your child’s life (if it’s yours), you should initiate contact as early as possible and try to get as many hours as possible.
Adam
I have always been prompt with my child support payments (for two kids) of .approx. 2k per month. My ex wife has decided that my son doesn’t want to live with me anymore and won’t try to encourage him to stay with me. She has already put in a request with the child support agency for an increase in child support based on me not having my son anymore. We have signed consent orders stating that we have equal care and equal nights. Can you please let me know my options, as the child support agency call centre was unsure what I can do. Many thanks.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Child Support only care about the actual, real care percentages, not what is meant to happen according to any document (including court orders and consent orders). Would suggest you initiate mediation straight away with a mediation professional (e.g. Relationships Australia). Agreed parenting orders should almost always be followed. Neither parent should treat a child seeing the other parent as something that’s optional for kids to choose to do or not. Tell Child Support that the consent orders still absolutely apply and that you’re going through a mediation process to ensure that they continue to be followed in the future.
Debts that shouldn’t be there
Iv got a question my partner and I have 4 kids (2 are my step kids) we have %50 care he’s was originally paying child support directly to his ex $350 a week but could no longer afford it and started paying $80, more than he needed to. So she went to child support with a piece of scribbled paper with signature saying he would pay $350. They accepted it as an agreement, She gave them an 8 yo address of house he owned. He was not notified, no letters of course and building a debt of $350 a week without knowing, he didn’t find out for 8 months, then they would not back date it and continue to charge $350 he was in a bad financial position could barely afford the $80.. which she claimed he wasn’t even paying. He was unable to do tax return, so they put him in high tax bracket. They stopped the $350 after a year of him fighting them. And went to $100.. That went on for two years !!!! Now all his financials are in order, tax is all done. With letters fro csa says he has a child support of 0 for those years , that in fact she would have been paying. So there is a giant debt with csa with huge penalties for an amount of child support that is not owed ?♀️ He doesn’t expect any payment from his ex because he didn’t do tax on time but in turn he shouldn’t have to pay a debt that should not be there. CSA you suck!! Is there anything we can really do?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
You could ask for a formal review (it starts with a review by another Child Support officer). Very hard to imagine that this would have happened if the genders were reversed. Need to approach them politely and make it clear that your partner has 50% care. They seem to have treated him like a “payer”. Need to make it clear that he was unable to do things that would normally be done to correct matters due to not receiving essential correspondence.
Helen
I understand that there are many people in circumstances that are not helping the most important people, our children. Relationships are usually messy in divorce. I have my children 100 percent of the care. No contact or funds received from the person who helped bring these beautiful humans into the world. Parting words were I would love nothing more than to see you all homeless and I will not stop until that happens. This person has since apparently not worked while not being on any income assistance. Has remarried before divorce hearing, travels frequently and holidays expensively. Is at the pub weekly and smokes. Now this is all done through hiding income in new relationship and holding no accounts etc himself. This is one case in many, so I don’t get any assistance from Child support to assist as they can only do what they can. Now being owed tens of thousands and been years since receiving a cent. I can not comprehend how there is no consequences for their complete disregard to their children. I suggest that If a parent does purposely go from $100000 plus job to no income and no income support like the dole etc that they should be doing community service. If they can’t apparently afford one cent of child support they could at least be giving to the community which would also make them too busy to be earning the apparent no income that they earn. The system needs to be making it harder to hurt and punish the innocent ones in the relationship. Our children.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Helen, there should be consequences in your case eventually. Tax evasion is illegal for example. Minimum support levels also exist and the growing debt from this won’t go away until he pays. Evidence of income, if it’s ever found, could be used to increase his income levels for child support purposes. Have you initiated a Change of Assessment?
Sam
Hi all,
The child support system needs a major overhaul. I receive child support for my 2 boys and pay it for my new husbands son. How does it justify that we pay more for one child then we get for 2.
My husbands Ex had a baby last yr and due to her not working our child support went up by over $200 even though our level of care also went up, due to finally getting court ordered visitation after a lengthy period of court and mediation we finally got the normal every second weekend and half the school holidays. Prior to court my husband was getting 1.5hrs a fortnight at the local town centre as she refused to let him spend time with his son, I only met his son last November after being with my husband for 4yrs as she also wouldnt let me meet him even though there has never been any sort of altercation.
His Ex is currently re married, has a baby and still living at home with her parents and has returned to work. However due to her low income last year we pay 100% of his sons care, 76% goes to his ex and we pay the 24% when he is in our care. He rang to let the csa know that her income isn’t right due to the fact she is working again and got told he has to lodge a form to get it re assessed. I dont understand why they don’t act like centrelink, if i range them and told them she wasn’t declaring income they’d look into it but because its our money the csa seem not to care, all the information on the website seems directed at the primary career not receiving the right money.
Does being repaid for over paying even exist?
Now for my sons, as i earn more then my ex he pays less child support. When i say less he earns over $70000 a year so not like he isn’t making a living. He moved over 3hrs away and comes up every other weekend and stays at his sisters to have the boys. They don’t have there own room or anything just camp out on the floor. He doesn’t buy them school uniforms, pay for their sports, half of the cost of school camps or expensive excursions nothing. He wouldn’t even pay half of my sons school fees, he has autism so he attends a special school, and has never contributed to the extra cost of having a child with special needs. I only get $50 a week per child, which would be enough for the basic needs but when the other parents refuses to buy the occasional pair of shoes for school etc its just not enough.
And the biggest issues is how the csa justifies one child receiving more child support then 2 especially when one is special needs,
They need to work out a better system that is more fair to both parties.
Wendy Wallis
My hubby has been paying for years we are up to his ladt child who is 18 and stil at school. What we have fou d really frustrating is that this child does not even speak to his father and has legally changed his surname to his step fathers , what a kick in the the guts to hubby , why should we have to pay for a child who clearly doesnt see his father as a father!!!
Stacy
Our dealings with CSA have been very trying. Over the last 8 years we have been overpaying CS due to CSA working out our rate of care incorrectly. And yes, she gets to keep the money. Then they entered our child in the system twice, so it looked like we had 2 dependents, not one. And yes they billed us for that. Now there seems to be a “glich” in the account. We have been trying to change the rate of care of one of my step sons to 0, as he is staying with his mother now. We have been told they are unable to do this and a case manager has now been assigned to our case and when they have sorted out the issue we will be contacted. Now his ex has been claiming the single parent pension the whole time, even though having a partner and husband the whole time. I am also aware that centrelink are auditing people who were claiming these payments and catching people doing the wrong thing. My question is if she did get court and her taxable incomes for the last god only knows how many years, decrease due to a payment that she should not have received. Can they bill us the difference?
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
No chance of what you describe happening. Too late to change past tax and child support assessments.
Richard
The number of legitimate issues raised here from so many different circumstances and perspectives really is concerning. I can only comment on my limited experience with CSA but hopefully it can be beneficial to someone in need if not the greater good.
Matty makes an excellent point above regarding the Family Court and its prejudices and that it’s “very convenient having the Family Court and the CSA separately administered (for the most part), because no-one has to take any responsibility for outcomes.”
Over 3 years in the family court I contributed an estimated $55k to my children’s mother. Combined with money from property settlement she spent $110k on lawyers and eventually got awarded the result she wanted: complete denial of access… Despite previously having access and complying with every court order no matter how ludicrous and despite many inconsistencies, I simply didn’t have the resources to contest the matter effectively. I had to pay her 1/3 my salary, pay the mortgage and all other usual household expenses and try to maintain full time employment (with the constant and literal threat that if I failed any of those tasks I would not see my children again), whilst she chose not to work despite having an earning capacity of ~$150k.
There were periods that I literally could not afford to feed myself when I had to engage a legal representative for one of the eight applications made by the mother, who refused to negotiate reasonable orders outside of the court.
The point being that CSA (dept of “inhuman services” ) did not care in the slightest. They simply recited their standard line: “we are not related to the family court” and made no attempt to question the mother’s earning capacity (Apparently the onus is on me to prove it…??) or acknowledge the litigious actions that were inhibiting my ability to pay at the calculated rate.
Ultimately I was forced to sell my house and use what little equity I had left to pay for court costs of the final trial… Whilst the settlement went through I was forced to use every cent I had on hand to secure the services of legal representation (I should add that being allowed by judges to self represent in the family court is a fairy tale; you have income therefore you can get a lawyer + barrister, “what’s the problem?”). If you fall behind in CSA payments as a result, not only do you incur the penalty of the CSA and more debt, the court will cite that as evidence that you don’t care about your children.
I entered a payment arrangement with CSA and honoured that arrangement. Regardless the CSA garnisheed my savings account without notice. When questioned, they justified that action with payment dates that contradicted my own bank statements and refused to respond to my requests to clarify their position despite numerous messages to do so.
They have now removed the messaging service from MyGov and refuse to communicate in writing at all, other than issuing statements and assessments. They continually change my payment assessments based on previous tax returns, despite being notified of my current circumstances and that I do not have that employment any longer (yes, hard to believe taking 1 week off in every 6 to attend to court matters is not acceptable in the professional world, and that I was unable to function after being told I can’t see my children ever, and then losing my house… Just more evidence that I’m not a suitable parent I guess..). They refuse to retract the amount accrued since the change of assessment, which made the difference to me being in credit to being significantly in debt. They refuse to accept the reason I was unaware of the debt is because I knew I was in credit and had recently notified them of my income, therefore checking their statements on the “mygov’ site was not a priority for me.
I have always paid more than required because my income is consistently overestimated, but they do not have a policy to account for over payment, and then threaten to penalise for underestimating future income, which at the moment is unknown.
As I see it the core issues that lead to these problems are these:
1 – No differentiation is made between parents that walk away and those that are refused custody.
2 – The cost to maintain the financial need of a child does not automatically change depending on the income of a parent. In a family situation it may, but that is a mutual decision of both parents and not representative of separated parents complying with legislation.
3 – The “self support amount” is based on a theoretical figure from the department of statistics that is averaged nationally and has no relevance whatsoever to the real world.
Suggestions:
1 – If a parent chooses to make application in the family court, child support amount should not be allocated until final orders are made, with the exception that any allegations of family violence or abuse that required the removal of the children are substantiated beyond doubt.
2 – Payments are made to a card. That card is used for all expenses relating to the child(ren) and available for reconciling. Future budgets are then based on justifiable expenses.
3 – The paying parent submits a living expense budget to be verified by the CSA as a self support amount or accepts a minimum living expenses allocation that reflects the area of historical residence of the family.
4 – Human service training for staff at CSA so that every conversation does not revolve around them disclosing nothing whilst using deceptive language and attempting to gain a client’s confidence entirely for the purpose of obtaining incriminating information.
Ange
Hi there, just wondering if anyone has any advice on objections to CSA? I’ll try to make a long story short…
My fiancé has 2 kids (8 & 6) with his ex-wife. For years, they managed a personal agreement where he would pay her a set amount per week and CSA was not involved at all. To paint a picture, she is the type of woman who after separating & then divorcing him, continue to ‘spend his money’ as though she was still entitled to it (ie. making sole decisions on what the kids should/shouldn’t have, buying it then demanding he pay for half of it). This came to a head when she organised a $1200 birthday party of their then 6 year old. Even though my partner wasn’t invited (she doesn’t feel that she should have to invite him to parties she arranges for them), she still demanded he pay for half & he refused. She has then contacted CSA to arrange all future support payments through them, which she’s entitled to do. I should at this point explain that my partner is by no means a ‘dead beat dad’ – he has always paid his support plus much more and aims to spend as much time as possible with the kids, so much so that he’s had to change his career in order to do so, now that they’re both at school. This is where problems with CSA really start. By changing career, he increased his care percentage which is fine. Unfortunately, he did take a $30k PA income loss…not great but manageable. As soon as this happened, he contacted CSA to advise of the income change and they amended his support payments, which worked out to be $70 less per week. If we look at the financial year as a whole, he paid the correct amount of support for his salary/care bracket for 10 months of 2017-18 and then when he changed jobs, paid the adjusted amount as per his new salary, which is also correct according to CSA.
Now we get to tax return time…once both he and his ex wife have lodged their returns, he starts getting a barrage of letters from CSA – all of them are the same but display completely different amounts. In his old position, he was on $82k pa and his in new position he’s on $55k pa….one of the letters stated he was to pay x amount of child support based on a $131k pa income!!!! On 3 separate occasions over the past couple of months, he’s received a minimum of 5 and up to 9 letters at once, all dated with the same date and all with different income figures. One of the more recent letters is a fine for apparently underestimating his wage – they’re claiming when he changed his salary information with them that he told them he had only earnt $53k (he didn’t tell them anything other than what his new salary was) from his previous job for the financial year but because his tax return came in at $76k, not only does he now have a fine of $205 but apparently he owes his ex over $2000 in unpaid support. As mentioned earlier, he has paid the correct amount of support for his salary/care bracket for the full year & has in fact somehow managed to pay her over $1000 in addition to what she was due. He’s tried talking to CSA over the phone and they just keep carrying on about their formula and make him sound like a criminal…personally I find it really upsetting and it’s absolutely rubbish how Dads are treated by the system…I know there’s some not so good ones out there but the majority are just trying to do the right thing and they make it impossible.
Anyway, apparently the only way he can oppose this additional $2000 is to submit an objection. Firstly he needs to provide a good reason as to why this wasn’t done within 28 days (we didn’t know about it and with the millions of letters from CSA, his time on the phone with them has been spent trying to work out whats what) and then he has to provide proof as to why he shouldn’t need to pay the additional money. If anyone has been through this process and/or has some helpful hints or tips, it would be very much appreciated!!!!
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Ange – All the letters do tend to create confusion. Child support is based on taxable income across the financial year. So, it seems like he legitimately owes the $2000. He could ask them to take away the $200 fine because it was an honest mistake and due to miscommunication. I wouldn’t get into reviews as his income could be put up to his highest former income if the other party makes a Change of Assessment Claim based on earning capacity.
Kate
I disagree with CSA supporting a thread where fathers complain about paying child support and they are encouraged by biased admin. Children are a financial sacrifice whether the parents are together or not. I work long hours to provide for my children, plus have 77% custody and receive no child support due to their father owning a business which provides $21,000, yet plenty of overseas travel, new car and an overall lavish lifestyle. I know that my situation is extreme, but my point is that I go without so that my children can have a similar lifestyle that they’d have if they were supported by both parents. It’s hard, I get it. You have to go without, I get it. The thing that paying parents neglect to consider is that if they pay more, often the caring parent can work less. This means more direct care for your child, and that equals = more home cooked meals, more help with homework, a parent able to attend sports games and cheer the children on, a happier carer with less stress and more stability. Why wouldn’t you want to do everything in your power to provide this for your child? (Even if it means that your ex may have a better lifestyle than you’d like them to have). I go without a lot for my children and take pride in that. They will grow up more well adjusted because of it and I know they do, and will continue to appreciate it. I hate child support threads that appear to forget about love for the children, are more fuelled by hate for the ex, and parents “rights” over the child’s right to be number one in both parents lives.
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Kate,
The new system we’re proposing would help you in your case (with the introduction of a general support benchmark) as well as the many thousands of fathers getting ripped off. Frankly, the number of men treated unfairly is far greater than the number of women, and many of those men are denied access to their children as well. It’s poor form to presume that their complaints are invalid or that they have inferior motives and moral standing to you. You’re not better than the rest of us. Please don’t label and dismiss people you don’t know and appear to have made no attempt to understand.
Raymond
I think these people are starting to be slowly exposed as the criminals they are… There is something very sinister going on trying to hide it’s ugly head. I believe it’s all to do with lowly Lawyers and solicitors making their way into high positions and pulling strings for financial gain. My ex was a school teacher, there was usually 10-20% of the class that required special needs and usually involved autism at some degree. Autistic people are smart to some degree, but lack in other areas, they somewhat make great government positions also for companies that want to make large financial gains, without any sort of compassion or morals on who they affect. These people I believe are slowly making their way into policies and decision making completely destroying families just to make a company, agency or judicial system look good and continue the greed for money. THE MODERN DAY STOLEN GENERATION, fuelling separation using children as leverage, children to these type of people are just seen as bags of money…
Andrew Lancaster (admin)
Whenever lawyers are involved in anything, it seems the only winners are the lawyers themselves (apologies to my lawyer friends and family). Unfortunately, for some weird reason, politicians always turn to lawyers for advice about how to run the child support system. Wish they would stop doing that and understand that lawyers are usually a hindrance more than a help when it comes to public policy.
Single father at wits end
Hi.
I have reached breaking point. I seperated from my eldests’ mother when he was 2. During the time together I provided for all three of us off my income as she didn’t work.
After we split, child support was enter d into as a ‘friend’ of hers pushed her to obtain finances to support the child – fair enough! (I WASNT against child support – and even now, I agree a parent SHOULD provide for their children).
Flash forward: I have seperated from previous partner after 2 children (currently 4 & 6) – we were together 10 years; she saw the struggle I had with C$A and we have avoided that path for our two (would likely be that she would have to pay me, as she is on more – but guess what? She works for her money and I try my best to meet her half way with expenses as much as humanly possible because they are OUR children!)
My issue is currently now: I have had inflicted on me, for the first time in 12 years – garnishing! Thing is, I was aware of missing maybe 2 payments of C$A, and one payment at approx. $150 lower than it should have been, however I wasn’t even given the option to pay this off – they have immediately moved to garnish wages. Is this even LEGAL?! I have called when I can (having HUGE issues – they are only open during ‘business hours’ – guess when I am at work? That’s right! ‘Business hours’! I have asked for alternative methods to deal with this – no email service OUT – but I can send my details, income etc TO them…)
I did manage to get a call on a Saturday morning (when I had all three of my children – so was trying to enjoy our weekend together, as the eldest isn’t with me as much as the two little ones). The lady was very rude, and when I tried to explain WHY I was behind on payments (short story: single father, just moved into a rental which is costing 40% of my income, debt with Telstra after early termination fee – there is more, but you get the idea) I got a very warm response of ‘well, you’ll have to sort something out then!’
With this garnishing, my two youngest, who I have card for 50% of the time (slightly more, in truth – but it usually evens out over a 12 month period) are now missing out on the ‘lifestyle they would have been afforded if both parents were together’ (to use a standard line from C$A…).
My payments have gone up for my eldest – but considering I didn’t hear from C$A until now as I was paying on time and (believed) the right amount – but now get ‘you’re behind on payments, you owe $X’ and a nice ‘let’s not even consider a payment plan that allows you to cope with bills – we’re just going to jump straight into wage garnishing’ – how does this help myself, and more importantly – ANY of my children?!
Hopefully my someone can explain what the purpose of C$A actually is – as if it’s to provide a standard of living for a child and ensure equality of care after a family breakdown, they really have missed the mark to the point I am hoping there is a class action against this agency…
Please, if anyone can explain why they would run a single father to breaking point, I really would like to hear – and if anyone has ANY advice regarding being able to continue to support my children but still be able to make ends meet, I would appreciate any suggestions – because at this point in time, I can see why C$A have caused good fathers to call it quits (AND good mothers – contrary to opinion, it can and DOES happen to decent mothers also – just that men are over represented in regards to this agency, unfortunately…).